Discussion:
EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025
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Isaac Montara
2025-01-03 05:09:11 UTC
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Permalink
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en

1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water

2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity

3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market

4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)

5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Scott
2025-01-03 09:47:10 UTC
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Permalink
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
Java Jive
2025-01-03 10:04:03 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
--
Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk
Scott
2025-01-03 10:08:16 UTC
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Permalink
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK. I take your
point going forward about the de facto standard, but my question was
whether the new regs would apply de jure.
Java Jive
2025-01-03 11:33:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK.
I haven't seen that other thread, but they may well be offloading old
stock pending newer models. Eventually market forces can be expected to
prevail.
Post by Scott
I take your
point going forward about the de facto standard, but my question was
whether the new regs would apply de jure.
Well obviously not as stated in the OP, because since Brexit we're no
longer bound by that legal system, otherwise Apple would not be selling
phones with lightning connectors here as claimed above. HMG would have
to bring in legislation of its own mirroring that of the EU, and I would
have thought if they were doing so we would have seen something about it
by now.

Mind, I've lost access to the BBC News RSS feeds, including the
Technology news feed, because the supplier of the translation script -
that enabled me to create on my PCs a web page summarising them - has
discontinued the service, so, as I've not had time to write my own, I've
not been keeping so well up to date for about three or four months now.
--
Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk
Chris
2025-01-03 13:12:05 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK.
I haven't seen that other thread, but they may well be offloading old
stock pending newer models. Eventually market forces can be expected to
prevail.
Apple have removed the iphone 14 and SE from sale in the EU and Northern
Ireland due to the regulations coming into effect on 30th December.

Both models are still available in the rest of the UK.
Andrew
2025-01-03 19:03:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK.
I haven't seen that other thread, but they may well be offloading old
stock pending newer models. Eventually market forces can be expected to
prevail.
Apple have removed the iphone 14 and SE from sale in the EU and Northern
Ireland due to the regulations coming into effect on 30th December.
Both models are still available in the rest of the UK.
While Android phones typically *double* the EU minimum standards...

Bear in mind that Apple is cognizant that their use of cheap batteries in
the iPhone means they'll have to label those same phones as very clearly
NOT meeting the upcoming 2025 EU battery charge-cycle lifetime standards.

Apple has always cheaped out on batteries and hardware (such as RAM).
Now Apple's addiction to cheap components returns to bite them back.

Not only has Apple always been cheap on batteries, but on RAM also.
Which means only the latest iPhones can run the memory intensive AI apps.

In other words, even the very few iPhones that "can" be sold in the EU
after June of this year still *barely* squeak by due to cheap components.

It's just more evidence of the obvious maxim: *Apple hates you*
Alan
2025-01-03 19:22:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Andrew
Post by Chris
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK.
I haven't seen that other thread, but they may well be offloading old
stock pending newer models.  Eventually market forces can be expected
to prevail.
Apple have removed the iphone 14 and SE from sale in the EU and Northern
Ireland due to the regulations coming into effect on 30th December.
Both models are still available in the rest of the UK.
Let's play, "Count the unsupported assertions"!
Post by Andrew
While Android phones typically *double* the EU minimum standards...
Unsupported assertion!
Post by Andrew
Bear in mind that Apple is cognizant that their use of cheap batteries in
the iPhone means they'll have to label those same phones as very clearly
NOT meeting the upcoming 2025 EU battery charge-cycle lifetime standards.
Unsupported assertion!
Post by Andrew
Apple has always cheaped out on batteries and hardware (such as RAM).
Two unsupported assertions!
Post by Andrew
Now Apple's addiction to cheap components returns to bite them back.
Not only has Apple always been cheap on batteries, but on RAM also.
Which means only the latest iPhones can run the memory intensive AI apps.
Another unsupported assertion!
Post by Andrew
In other words, even the very few iPhones that "can" be sold in the EU
after June of this year still *barely* squeak by due to cheap components.
Another!
Post by Andrew
It's just more evidence of the obvious maxim: *Apple hates you*
Unsupported assertion and obvious bullshit on top of it!
micky
2025-01-08 18:46:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
In comp.mobile.android, on Fri, 3 Jan 2025 11:22:06 -0800, Alan
Post by Alan
Post by Andrew
Post by Chris
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK.
I haven't seen that other thread, but they may well be offloading old
stock pending newer models.  Eventually market forces can be expected
to prevail.
Apple have removed the iphone 14 and SE from sale in the EU and Northern
Ireland due to the regulations coming into effect on 30th December.
Both models are still available in the rest of the UK.
Let's play, "Count the unsupported assertions"!
Post by Andrew
While Android phones typically *double* the EU minimum standards...
Unsupported assertion!
Post by Andrew
Bear in mind that Apple is cognizant that their use of cheap batteries in
the iPhone means they'll have to label those same phones as very clearly
NOT meeting the upcoming 2025 EU battery charge-cycle lifetime standards.
Unsupported assertion!
Post by Andrew
Apple has always cheaped out on batteries and hardware (such as RAM).
Two unsupported assertions!
Post by Andrew
Now Apple's addiction to cheap components returns to bite them back.
Not only has Apple always been cheap on batteries, but on RAM also.
Which means only the latest iPhones can run the memory intensive AI apps.
Another unsupported assertion!
Post by Andrew
In other words, even the very few iPhones that "can" be sold in the EU
after June of this year still *barely* squeak by due to cheap components.
Another!
Post by Andrew
It's just more evidence of the obvious maxim: *Apple hates you*
Unsupported assertion and obvious bullshit on top of it!
It's easy to make things up. While less notable when it attacks a
corporation or its product, it's more noticeable and more important when
it attacks a person, a race, a religion, a national group, a political
grou, and liars do that all the time to promote their own interests.
Chris
2025-01-03 13:12:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Evidently it is not quite as simple as that. In another thread it is
explained that Apple have withdrawn phones with lightning connectors
from the EU market and continue to sell them in the UK. I take your
point going forward about the de facto standard, but my question was
whether the new regs would apply de jure.
Nope. That was the main argument for brexit. We in the UK are no longer
bound by the EU regulations.

The result, as shown with the lightning port, is that we're now dependent
on the business decisions of Apple et al. Obviously, they have to comply
with EU regs and some will trickle down to the UK market, but not all, as
deemed by Apple.

UK gov may choose to do something about it.
Tweed
2025-01-03 10:14:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Well yes and no. The rules requiring Apple to allow third party App stores
do not apply to GB and you can’t access them in GB. (I’m being very careful
to exclude NI as I’m not sure how it works out for them). I pass no comment
on the rights and wrongs of such App stores, just pointing out that the EU
and GB markets are not entirely coincident.

Take the rule for battery life. If your phone battery breaches the 800
cycle 80% rule in the EU you might have rights to get the battery replaced
free of charge, and you might not have those rights in GB.
MikeS
2025-01-03 10:29:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tweed
Post by Java Jive
Post by Scott
On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 00:09:11 -0500, Isaac Montara
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches
& protection from dust & water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand
at least 800 charge and discharge cycles
while retaining at least 80% of their initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations
for producers to make critical spare parts available
within 5-10 working days, and for 7 years after
the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods
(at least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on
the market of the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers
to any software or firmware needed for the replacement
Will these regulations apply in the UK?
As you have had explained to you at least twice before, they will become
a de facto standard, because it won't be worth the cost to the
manufacturers to produce a substantially different model for every
different market; on the contrary they will try and keep as much as
possible of every product the same world-wide.
Well yes and no. The rules requiring Apple to allow third party App stores
do not apply to GB and you can’t access them in GB. (I’m being very careful
to exclude NI as I’m not sure how it works out for them). I pass no comment
on the rights and wrongs of such App stores, just pointing out that the EU
and GB markets are not entirely coincident.
Take the rule for battery life. If your phone battery breaches the 800
cycle 80% rule in the EU you might have rights to get the battery replaced
free of charge, and you might not have those rights in GB.
All of that is related to usage, not the design/construction of the
phone hardware. Apple may well continue to sell some existing production
in the UK but as already said it is unlikely they will make special UK
versions of new hardware.
Chris
2025-01-03 13:20:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by MikeS
Apple may well continue to sell some existing production
in the UK but as already said it is unlikely they will make special UK
versions of new hardware.
Definitely true. The UK (or more likely GB) won't get specific models, but,
as we're already seeing, will still get any models which do not comply with
the EU regs .
Andrew
2025-01-03 19:07:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by MikeS
Apple may well continue to sell some existing production
in the UK but as already said it is unlikely they will make special UK
versions of new hardware.
Definitely true. The UK (or more likely GB) won't get specific models, but,
as we're already seeing, will still get any models which do not comply with
the EU regs .
Bear in mind that no iPhone older than the iPhone 15 meets the bare minimum
battery lifetime charge cycle EU standard, while Android phones double it.

The reason?
Apple has always been addicted to putting cheap components in their iPhone.

Putting that well known fact in context, it's further evidence that...
*Apple hates you*.
Alan
2025-01-03 19:22:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Andrew
Post by Chris
Apple may well continue to sell some existing production in the UK
but as already said it is unlikely they will make special UK versions
of new hardware.
Definitely true. The UK (or more likely GB) won't get specific models, but,
as we're already seeing, will still get any models which do not comply with
the EU regs .
Bear in mind that no iPhone older than the iPhone 15 meets the bare minimum
battery lifetime charge cycle EU standard, while Android phones double it.
Prove it.
Pamela
2025-01-05 16:17:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Tweed
[snip]
Well yes and no. The rules requiring Apple to allow third party App
stores do not apply to GB and you can’t access them in GB. (I’m
being very careful to exclude NI as I’m not sure how it works out
for them). I pass no comment on the rights and wrongs of such App
stores, just pointing out that the EU and GB markets are not entirely
coincident.
Take the rule for battery life. If your phone battery breaches the 800
cycle 80% rule in the EU you might have rights to get the battery
replaced free of charge, and you might not have those rights in GB.
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Andy Burns
2025-01-05 16:29:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
Tweed
2025-01-05 16:45:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en

2027, though I can’t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Scott
2025-01-05 17:25:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can’t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
Tweed
2025-01-05 17:33:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can’t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don’t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
Scott
2025-01-05 17:44:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don’t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Tweed
2025-01-05 17:47:44 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don’t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Unlikely. Batteries are around £2500 per 10kWhr retail judging by the cost
of a house battery.
Scott
2025-01-05 18:05:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:47:44 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don?t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Unlikely. Batteries are around £2500 per 10kWhr retail judging by the cost
of a house battery.
Would it not allow an aftermarket for generic batteries instead of
being bound by the OEM? I was offered a second hand Zoe at a very low
price at one stage but when I realised the battery arrangements (lease
from Renault) and the very low range of such a model I dismissed the
idea very quickly.
Theo
2025-01-05 20:19:22 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:47:44 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don?t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Unlikely. Batteries are around £2500 per 10kWhr retail judging by the cost
of a house battery.
Would it not allow an aftermarket for generic batteries instead of
being bound by the OEM? I was offered a second hand Zoe at a very low
price at one stage but when I realised the battery arrangements (lease
from Renault) and the very low range of such a model I dismissed the
idea very quickly.
EV batteries weigh about 200kg. Consumers aren't going to be changing them
because they don't have the lifting gear (hydraulic lifts and scissor
tables). If you have gear unscrewing them from the bottom of the vehicle is
not complicated, although could be dangerous without safety precautions. In
no world are consumers going to be changing them like they change wiper
blades.

Batteries are designed to fit the car so you need to swap in an OEM battery
- just like engines it may theoretically be possible to swap something else,
but it's a lot of work (mechanically, electrically and software). There is
no standard 1.6 engine that'll fit in every car, and batteries are similarly
bespoke.

Theo
Scott
2025-01-05 20:44:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 05 Jan 2025 20:19:22 +0000 (GMT), Theo
Post by Theo
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:47:44 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don?t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Unlikely. Batteries are around £2500 per 10kWhr retail judging by the cost
of a house battery.
Would it not allow an aftermarket for generic batteries instead of
being bound by the OEM? I was offered a second hand Zoe at a very low
price at one stage but when I realised the battery arrangements (lease
from Renault) and the very low range of such a model I dismissed the
idea very quickly.
EV batteries weigh about 200kg. Consumers aren't going to be changing them
because they don't have the lifting gear (hydraulic lifts and scissor
tables). If you have gear unscrewing them from the bottom of the vehicle is
not complicated, although could be dangerous without safety precautions. In
no world are consumers going to be changing them like they change wiper
blades.
Batteries are designed to fit the car so you need to swap in an OEM battery
- just like engines it may theoretically be possible to swap something else,
but it's a lot of work (mechanically, electrically and software). There is
no standard 1.6 engine that'll fit in every car, and batteries are similarly
bespoke.
That puts paid to the idea of having a standard battery for all the
cars and swapping them from underneath at the filling station using a
mechanical arm as was suggested at one time :-)
Your Name
2025-01-05 21:15:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
On 05 Jan 2025 20:19:22 +0000 (GMT), Theo
Post by Theo
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:47:44 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don?t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A
user replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Unlikely. Batteries are around £2500 per 10kWhr retail judging by the
cost of a house battery.
Would it not allow an aftermarket for generic batteries instead of
being bound by the OEM? I was offered a second hand Zoe at a very low
price at one stage but when I realised the battery arrangements (lease
from Renault) and the very low range of such a model I dismissed the
idea very quickly.
EV batteries weigh about 200kg. Consumers aren't going to be changing them
because they don't have the lifting gear (hydraulic lifts and scissor
tables). If you have gear unscrewing them from the bottom of the vehicle is
not complicated, although could be dangerous without safety precautions. In
no world are consumers going to be changing them like they change wiper
blades.
Batteries are designed to fit the car so you need to swap in an OEM battery
- just like engines it may theoretically be possible to swap something else,
but it's a lot of work (mechanically, electrically and software). There is
no standard 1.6 engine that'll fit in every car, and batteries are similarly
bespoke.
That puts paid to the idea of having a standard battery for all the
cars and swapping them from underneath at the filling station using a
mechanical arm as was suggested at one time :-)
There are already some battery pack swapping robot places for EV cars
and it can be done in five minutes or less, although it depends on the
car model, etc. and reportedly is expensive. Most of these places are
currently in China, but there are a few in other places (California has
a few Nio swap stations).

At one point there was the idea of having multiple smaller battery
packs that could be easily user swappable in the same simple "plug 'n'
play" way as many electric tools. It was also suggest the small battery
packs could be swapped at places like supermarkets and petrol stations
(deposit a flat battery, take a full one, and the flat battery is
recharged for another user). This idea hasn't been taken up by any
manufacturer yet.

Part of the problem is the cvar manufacturers all having their own
designs for the battery packs and how they are fitted. There would need
to be a standardisation before easy battery swapping became a real
possibility.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-05 21:29:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
On 05 Jan 2025 20:19:22 +0000 (GMT), Theo
Post by Theo
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:47:44 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 17:33:29 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Scott
On Sun, 5 Jan 2025 16:45:14 -0000 (UTC), Tweed
Post by Tweed
Post by Andy Burns
Post by Pamela
Wasn't there also a requirement for the battery to be user replaceable?
Not in effect for a couple of years, I think ...
https://environment.ec.europa.eu/news/new-law-more-sustainable-circular-and-safe-batteries-enters-force-2023-08-17_en
2027, though I can?t find an exact date. Not just phones either.
Electric vehicles?
I don?t think so. Things like power tools, radios, toothbrushes etc. A user
replaceable EV battery could be quite a dangerous affair.
It might improve the residual value though.
Unlikely. Batteries are around £2500 per 10kWhr retail judging by the cost
of a house battery.
Would it not allow an aftermarket for generic batteries instead of
being bound by the OEM? I was offered a second hand Zoe at a very low
price at one stage but when I realised the battery arrangements (lease
from Renault) and the very low range of such a model I dismissed the
idea very quickly.
EV batteries weigh about 200kg. Consumers aren't going to be changing them
because they don't have the lifting gear (hydraulic lifts and scissor
tables). If you have gear unscrewing them from the bottom of the vehicle is
not complicated, although could be dangerous without safety precautions. In
no world are consumers going to be changing them like they change wiper
blades.
Batteries are designed to fit the car so you need to swap in an OEM battery
- just like engines it may theoretically be possible to swap something else,
but it's a lot of work (mechanically, electrically and software). There is
no standard 1.6 engine that'll fit in every car, and batteries are similarly
bespoke.
That puts paid to the idea of having a standard battery for all the
cars and swapping them from underneath at the filling station using a
mechanical arm as was suggested at one time :-)
No, because those cars and their batteries were designed for this method.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-08 20:02:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-
and-tablets_en
I still can not figure out what the Subject of this thread means:

Re: EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025

??
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Alan
2025-01-08 20:20:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/
smartphones- and-tablets_en
Re: EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025
??
Bad typing. The OP's right hand was one key to the right of the correct
key for a few letters.

"Re: EI mew ;abeling ..."
"Re: EU new labeling ..."

"I" is one to the right of "U", etc.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-08 21:44:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/
smartphones- and-tablets_en
Re: EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025
??
Bad typing. The OP's right hand was one key to the right of the correct
key for a few letters.
"Re: EI mew ;abeling ..."
"Re: EU new labeling ..."
"I" is one to the right of "U", etc.
Ah, ok. My keyboard is different, the ";" is to the right of the "m".
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Andy Burns
2025-01-08 20:37:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
When I saw "Isaac Montara" the needle on my
new-arlen-nym-o-meter started wobbling
Post by Carlos E.R.
Re: EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025
I read it as "EU new labelling regulations"
Scott
2025-01-08 20:44:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Andy Burns
When I saw "Isaac Montara" the needle on my
new-arlen-nym-o-meter started wobbling
Post by Carlos E.R.
Re: EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025
I read it as "EU new labelling regulations"
It did not take me long to work this out either.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-08 21:57:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Scott
Post by Andy Burns
When I saw "Isaac Montara" the needle on my
new-arlen-nym-o-meter started wobbling
Post by Carlos E.R.
Re: EI mew ;abeling regulations June 20th 2025
I read it as "EU new labelling regulations"
It did not take me long to work this out either.
I also have this suspicion, but I need more posts to make sure. Wait,
there are more posts, going back to July. [...] Yeah, score increased.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-09 16:22:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Hi Andy,

Happy New Year!
Just respond to the value of the body of the message - not the headers.

I read everything on this newsgroup, Andy, that you write. Everything.

Also everything from Arno. Frank. Gelato. Bev. Steve. Jeff. Zaidy. etc. on
the Android newsgroup, but far fewer on the Apple newsgroups, although I
read everything from badgolferman & Steve, who had been posted to Usenet
for decades just as I have been. I even read what Jolly Roger posts,
believe it or not, as he's the quintessential Apple poster of all time.

Probably 80% of the Android posters (like micky) know nothing and worse,
can't learn anything, while it's far worse than that for the Apple trolls.

But I have each poster well under control with a system that scores them.

I long ago added that scoring system which marks morons as already read.
But it continually adds points to your posts & to those of others above.

Not so much the rest.
It ignores posts from Alan & Joerg but also subtracts points from others.

It's constantly keeping track of the intelligence level of each poster.
You're intelligent but most people on this newsgroup are low-IQ morons.

For example, when you posted that Marcel wrote NetGuard, I hit the macro to
bump your score, just as it did when you kept abreast of Marcel's
successful OAUTH2 additions to FairEmail; but it bumps you down every time
you call me a spammer (which you sometimes do, much to your discredit).

While you provide valuable insight, I've likely provided many times more
than all the rest of you combined, Andy, to this newsgroup, in the form of
knowledge about how Android actually works & in the form of tutorials.

But I still learn a lot of from the likes of those few listed above, Andy.
So there's value for me in this newsgroup, even as I deplore the morons.

Around every new year the script triggers, Andy, for privacy reasons, where
I may know privacy probably better than all the rest of you do, combined.

Periodically, the nyms change, as do the time zones, the posting hosts, the
nntp servers, the newsreader, etc., all of which is done for privacy Andy.

You are smart enough to know that keeping the same headers for two decades
or more isn't the best thing if you want to retain some privacy on the net.

Most people are completely clueless about the basics of privacy, Andy.

Maybe not you. But almost everyone else on this newsgroup has sacrificed
their privacy (which is fine) but then they denigrate others that don't.

I don't hide who I am in the gift of the value of the body of the article.
It's only in the meaningless wrapping paper surrounding that body, Andy.

With that in mind, if it takes anyone more than a few seconds to figure out
that it's the same detailed annotated images, the same phone even, the same
location, the same exacting super-detailed always precise information,
etc., they that just means they are low-IQ utter morons, as I never change.

I'm not hiding from you. I don't even try.
I'm hiding the headers from robotic data-collection engines.

It's all done with a process that uses telnet and scripts written years
ago, thanks mostly to Marek (and a few others), mostly on the Linux ngs.

It randomizes the nntp news server (although I can keep it if I like); and
it randomizes the VPN IP address, time posted & other meaningless headers.

The hardest part was the algorithm for the randomized dictionary swaps.

Even Vanguard & Frank helped write the scripts, although neither of them
knew that's what they were doing, I'm sure, as the scripts are complex.

Then it was ported to Windows and that's where the automation proceeds.
Telnet does most of the work. The headers are dictionary lookups.

It used to be that the headers randomly copied other nyms from other
newsgroups and other headers from different posts, so as to mix things up,
but then it accidentally picked up people here so I cut that part out.

Now it just picks everything from a set of a half-dozen dictionaries.

I don't even know what nym is being used as it doesn't matter the nym.
Often I don't even know what person I'm responding to as what matters is
not their pedigree but what they said in the post that contained value.

My editor is "Gvim" and the user agent is telnet if that matters to you.
Only fools care more about the wrapping paper than the gift being provided.

In short...

Anyone who says "I figured you out" is proclaiming that they're a moron,
especially if it takes more than one post for them to figure that out.

Let me know what the nym is for this post as I don't even see it, so I
won't know what it is until *after* this post is reflected in my feed.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-09 19:46:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Hi Andy,
Happy New Year!
Just respond to the value of the body of the message - not the headers.
I read everything on this newsgroup, Andy, that you write. Everything.
1
Post by Marion
Also everything from Arno. Frank. Gelato. Bev. Steve. Jeff. Zaidy. etc. on
the Android newsgroup, but far fewer on the Apple newsgroups, although I
read everything from badgolferman & Steve, who had been posted to Usenet
for decades just as I have been. I even read what Jolly Roger posts,
believe it or not, as he's the quintessential Apple poster of all time.
Probably 80% of the Android posters (like micky) know nothing and worse,
can't learn anything, while it's far worse than that for the Apple trolls.
But I have each poster well under control with a system that scores them.
2

And you are a new poster, new name.
Post by Marion
I long ago added that scoring system which marks morons as already read.
But it continually adds points to your posts & to those of others above.
Not so much the rest.
It ignores posts from Alan & Joerg but also subtracts points from others.
It's constantly keeping track of the intelligence level of each poster.
You're intelligent but most people on this newsgroup are low-IQ morons.
For example, when you posted that Marcel wrote NetGuard, I hit the macro to
bump your score, just as it did when you kept abreast of Marcel's
successful OAUTH2 additions to FairEmail; but it bumps you down every time
you call me a spammer (which you sometimes do, much to your discredit).
"you call me" — how, if you are a new poster? I feel a smell...

3
Post by Marion
While you provide valuable insight, I've likely provided many times more
What, a first time poster

4
Post by Marion
than all the rest of you combined, Andy, to this newsgroup, in the form of
knowledge about how Android actually works & in the form of tutorials.
But I still learn a lot of from the likes of those few listed above, Andy.
So there's value for me in this newsgroup, even as I deplore the morons.
Around every new year the script triggers, Andy, for privacy reasons, where
I may know privacy probably better than all the rest of you do, combined.
Periodically, the nyms change, as do the time zones, the posting hosts, the
nntp servers, the newsreader, etc., all of which is done for privacy Andy.
& 5! Hi, Arlen!
Post by Marion
You are smart enough to know that keeping the same headers for two decades
or more isn't the best thing if you want to retain some privacy on the net.
Bullshit.
Post by Marion
Most people are completely clueless about the basics of privacy, Andy.
Maybe not you. But almost everyone else on this newsgroup has sacrificed
their privacy (which is fine) but then they denigrate others that don't.
I don't hide who I am in the gift of the value of the body of the article.
It's only in the meaningless wrapping paper surrounding that body, Andy.
With that in mind, if it takes anyone more than a few seconds to figure out
that it's the same detailed annotated images, the same phone even, the same
location, the same exacting super-detailed always precise information,
etc., they that just means they are low-IQ utter morons, as I never change.
I'm not hiding from you. I don't even try.
I'm hiding the headers from robotic data-collection engines.
It's all done with a process that uses telnet and scripts written years
ago, thanks mostly to Marek (and a few others), mostly on the Linux ngs.
It randomizes the nntp news server (although I can keep it if I like); and
it randomizes the VPN IP address, time posted & other meaningless headers.
The hardest part was the algorithm for the randomized dictionary swaps.
Even Vanguard & Frank helped write the scripts, although neither of them
knew that's what they were doing, I'm sure, as the scripts are complex.
Then it was ported to Windows and that's where the automation proceeds.
Telnet does most of the work. The headers are dictionary lookups.
It used to be that the headers randomly copied other nyms from other
newsgroups and other headers from different posts, so as to mix things up,
but then it accidentally picked up people here so I cut that part out.
Now it just picks everything from a set of a half-dozen dictionaries.
I don't even know what nym is being used as it doesn't matter the nym.
Often I don't even know what person I'm responding to as what matters is
not their pedigree but what they said in the post that contained value.
My editor is "Gvim" and the user agent is telnet if that matters to you.
Only fools care more about the wrapping paper than the gift being provided.
In short...
Anyone who says "I figured you out" is proclaiming that they're a moron,
especially if it takes more than one post for them to figure that out.
Let me know what the nym is for this post as I don't even see it, so I
won't know what it is until *after* this post is reflected in my feed.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-09 20:49:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
& 5! Hi, Arlen!
I repeat, verbatim...

"Anyone who says 'I figured you out' is proclaiming that they're a moron"

It's no wonder your IQ score is highly negative, Carlos.
Just above that of Chris s|b but below that of Stan, Frank & Vanguard.

BTW, I don't even know what nym is being used as it doesn't matter the nym.
What matters is the invaluable detailed knowledge imparted in the body.

However, since I flip the switch routinely around the turn of the year,
apparently this new 2025 nym is "Marion" (which you knew before I did).

Here's an image, just like all the other images for the past decade.
<Loading Image...>

You can cross-check with any reverse image search to find that it's mine.
I've been posting the same style of images, Carlos, for over a decade.

If people can't figure out who I am from that, then they're utter morons.
That's how easy it is to figure out my posts, Carlos, which I don't hide.

And yet, like the handicapped child who screams out in joy "I found it"
when he picks up the huge Easter egg on the table completely unhidden,
the lower the IQ the more people like you, Carlos, scream out in joy...

"I found you!"

Note that you guys consistently finger people who are NOT me, all the time,
as me, where I chuckle in mirth (especially those like Frank Slootweg who
think they're utter geniuses but who are so wrong that it's amusing to me).

I didn't even know who I was just now until I read my own post, Carlos.
Who I am does NOT show up in my GVim editing (which doesn't show headers).

So the only way I even know whom I'm responding to is from the attribution
line, which is also randomized (as is everything but the valuable body).

Every time someone screams out "I found you!", it's always low-IQ morons.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-09 21:01:32 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
& 5!  Hi, Arlen!
I repeat, verbatim...
"Anyone who says 'I figured you out' is proclaiming that they're a moron"
It's no wonder your IQ score is highly negative, Carlos.
Insults again. Not reading the rest.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-10 00:36:41 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading the rest.
Then you should be able to figure my posts out just from the response
showing what I think of the lack of value you impart in every reply.

Anyone who claims "I found you" is no different than the mentally
handicapped person who says the same when finding the not hidden egg.

That you think I'm "hiding" from you shows how low your IQ really is
when I change nothing but the meaningless wrapping paper even after being
on this newsgroup almost since its inception.

I periodically change the header wrapping paper for the aggregators.
Not for you - although you're so stupid - maybe it does hide from you.

What I find funny is when you low-IQ morons claim you "finally" found what
was never hidden in the first place - as it shows how DK you really are.
Alan
2025-01-10 01:52:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading the rest.
Then you should be able to figure my posts out just from the response
showing what I think of the lack of value you impart in every reply.
Anyone who claims "I found you" is no different than the mentally
handicapped person who says the same when finding the not hidden egg.
That you think I'm "hiding" from you shows how low your IQ really is
when I change nothing but the meaningless wrapping paper even after being
on this newsgroup almost since its inception.
I periodically change the header wrapping paper for the aggregators.
Not for you - although you're so stupid - maybe it does hide from you.
What I find funny is when you low-IQ morons claim you "finally" found what
was never hidden in the first place - as it shows how DK you really are.
You should be punched right in the face.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-10 03:17:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading the rest.
Then you should be able to figure my posts out just from the response
showing what I think of the lack of value you impart in every reply.
Insulting again. Not reading, troll.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-10 06:43:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading
The point is you deserved what you got for your moronically triumphant
claiming of "*I found it!*" (as if it was hidden) just like the handicapped
children always do when they "find" the NOT-hidden Easter egg, Carlos.
Alan
2025-01-10 08:47:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading
The point is you deserved what you got for your moronically triumphant
claiming of "*I found it!*" (as if it was hidden) just like the handicapped
children always do when they "find" the NOT-hidden Easter egg, Carlos.
Did I say "punched"?

I meant "bitch-slapped".
Frank Slootweg
2025-01-10 15:47:27 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by Marion
& 5!  Hi, Arlen!
I repeat, verbatim...
"Anyone who says 'I figured you out' is proclaiming that they're a moron"
It's no wonder your IQ score is highly negative, Carlos.
Insults again. Not reading the rest.
Don't worry about it.

In this short subthread he both praised and insulted me, while I have
not responded to him, not now and not in a long time. Normally he has
some bogus 'explanation' for this inconsistent behaviour of his, but
even that can not apply in this case.

So if *someone* shouldn't be saying anything about IQs, ...

[From this subthread:]

"I read everything on this newsgroup, Andy, that you write. Everything.

Also everything from Arno. Frank. Gelato. Bev. Steve. Jeff. Zaidy. etc. on
the Android newsgroup
...
Even Vanguard & Frank helped write the scripts, although neither of them
knew that's what they were doing, I'm sure, as the scripts are
complex."

But then:

"Note that you guys consistently finger people who are NOT me, all the time,
as me, where I chuckle in mirth (especially those like Frank Slootweg who
think they're utter geniuses but who are so wrong that it's amusing to me)."

BTW, he never mentioned any specifics on this and I didn't get any
complaints from these - allegedly - 'wrong' people.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-10 19:29:20 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by Marion
& 5!  Hi, Arlen!
I repeat, verbatim...
"Anyone who says 'I figured you out' is proclaiming that they're a moron"
It's no wonder your IQ score is highly negative, Carlos.
Insults again. Not reading the rest.
Don't worry about it.
In this short subthread he both praised and insulted me, while I have
not responded to him, not now and not in a long time. Normally he has
some bogus 'explanation' for this inconsistent behaviour of his, but
even that can not apply in this case.
So if *someone* shouldn't be saying anything about IQs, ...
[From this subthread:]
"I read everything on this newsgroup, Andy, that you write. Everything.
Also everything from Arno. Frank. Gelato. Bev. Steve. Jeff. Zaidy. etc. on
the Android newsgroup
...
Even Vanguard & Frank helped write the scripts, although neither of them
knew that's what they were doing, I'm sure, as the scripts are
complex."
"Note that you guys consistently finger people who are NOT me, all the time,
as me, where I chuckle in mirth (especially those like Frank Slootweg who
think they're utter geniuses but who are so wrong that it's amusing to me)."
But then that other people could complain that they are not Arlen, and
those I noticed that I remember did not complain.
Post by Frank Slootweg
BTW, he never mentioned any specifics on this and I didn't get any
complaints from these - allegedly - 'wrong' people.
Right.

This is the behaviour of a troll, not of a kind person as he recently
says. Certainly not justified with "privacy".
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-10 21:20:12 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Certainly not justified with "privacy".
Carlos,

You're a moron if you can't distinguish between a header & a body.

If it takes you more than 1 or 2 posts to figure out the body, then there
is something drastically wrong with you since even my images are the same
over the years - and they're all unique - as nobody posts what I post.
<https://i.postimg.cc/x1BL0M8G/shortcut-location-accuracy04.jpg>

After seeing just one of those, anyone who claims "I'm hiding" from them is
simply stating that they're like the mentally handicapped who claim "I
found it" when they see the Easter egg on the table which is not hidden.

You deserve my mocking, Carlos, because you publicly invited me to do so.

To wit:
If you had not screamed out like a handicapped child that you found
the Easter egg which was never hidden in the first place, then I would
not have mocked you for acting exactly like those handicapped kids do.

You caused this mockery of you by your own public absurdities Carlos.
Not me.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-10 21:42:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Certainly not justified with "privacy".
Carlos,
You're a moron if you can't distinguish between a header & a body.
Not reading, insulting again.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-10 23:13:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading
Good.

Maybe you've finally learned your lesson that to scream out "*I found it!*"
when it was never hidden in the first place, is the height of absurdity.

Who is *that* stupid to proclaim they finally found what was never hidden.
Answer: You.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-11 02:18:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Not reading
Good.
Maybe you've finally learned your lesson that to scream out "*I found it!*"
when it was never hidden in the first place, is the height of absurdity.
Who is *that* stupid to proclaim they finally found what was never hidden.
Answer: You.
Maybe you will learn that you are stupid insulting people one day if
people stop reading you you.

Oh wait... you are a troll.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-11 05:18:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Maybe you will learn that you are stupid insulting people
OK. Let's run a simple empirical experiment, shall we?

a. You stop wrongfully accusing me of hiding in the message body
b. And I'll stop proving that you're a moron by pointing to what you do

How's that for a good experiment, Carlos?
A. You immediately stop insulting me (which is what started this tangent).
B. Then I'll stop responding to your insults (because they won't be there).

Deal?
That way we can get back to kind-hearted purposefully helpful posts.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-11 14:27:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Maybe you will learn that you are stupid insulting people
OK. Let's run a simple empirical experiment, shall we?
a. You stop wrongfully accusing me of hiding in the message body
But you do hide. You are constantly changing names in order to confuse
people in thinking you are a new guy instead of old Arlen and evading
kill file filters.
Post by Marion
b. And I'll stop proving that you're a moron by pointing to what you do
Everybody knows you lie and insult when people do not agree with what
you say.
Post by Marion
How's that for a good experiment, Carlos?
A. You immediately stop insulting me (which is what started this tangent).
I have never insulted you. Post the quote.
Post by Marion
B. Then I'll stop responding to your insults (because they won't be there).
Deal?
That way we can get back to kind-hearted purposefully helpful posts.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-11 17:32:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Maybe you will learn that you are stupid insulting people
OK. Let's run a simple empirical experiment, shall we?
a. You stop wrongfully accusing me of hiding in the message body
But you do hide. You are constantly changing names in order to confuse
people in thinking you are a new guy instead of old Arlen and evading
kill file filters.
Post by Marion
b. And I'll stop proving that you're a moron by pointing to what you do
Everybody knows you lie and insult when people do not agree with what
you say.
Post by Marion
How's that for a good experiment, Carlos?
A. You immediately stop insulting me (which is what started this tangent).
I have never insulted you. Post the quote.
Post by Marion
B. Then I'll stop responding to your insults (because they won't be there).
Deal?
That way we can get back to kind-hearted purposefully helpful posts.
Jesus Christ Carlos.

What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.

You can't possibly add even a single iota of on-topic value.
In fact, everything from you *subtracts* value from this thread Carlos.

To you the earth is flat. The sun revolves around the earth. 1+1=3
And gravity is a supernatural force that acts instantly at a distance.

But that's all wrong Carlos.
Yet your absurd argument is as if all those things are true, Carlos.

I'm not hiding from you, Carlos, in the body of the message.
Get that into your super-smooth brain please.

FACT!
I post from the same Santa Cruz mountains for decades, Carlos.
My free galaxy never changes Carlos, & I often even post my bill.
I always care about privacy. And I always make use of free ad free apps.

I post the same detailed annotated images which only I post, Carlos.
<https://i.postimg.cc/x1BL0M8G/shortcut-location-accuracy04.jpg>
I don't even change the unique homescreen Carlos. Nor the writing color.

For Christ sake Carlos, if that's "hiding" to you, then Lord help you when
someone is actually hiding from you.

The very fact you scream out in public joyous absurdly unfathomable ecstasy
that *I FOUND YOU!!!!!!!* says far more about you than it does about me.

When you stop insulting me, I'll stop responding to your insults, Carlos.
Same with Frank who accuses everyone of being me. Just stop those insults.

Now can we get back to kind-hearted purposefully helpful posts please?
Jörg Lorenz
2025-01-13 17:00:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
Arlen, you are a Troll. Another brain dead identity. Using a girl's name
increases your suvrvivablity? *ROTFLSTC*
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Alan
2025-01-13 17:15:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Marion
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
Arlen, you are a Troll. Another brain dead identity. Using a girl's name
increases your suvrvivablity? *ROTFLSTC*
Now be fair!

"Marion" is a name that is occasionally seen for males.


<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_(given_name)>
Jörg Lorenz
2025-01-14 10:41:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Marion
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
Arlen, you are a Troll. Another brain dead identity. Using a girl's name
increases your suvrvivablity? *ROTFLSTC*
Now be fair!
"Marion" is a name that is occasionally seen for males.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_(given_name)>
Hardly ever.
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Arno Welzel
2025-01-14 12:17:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Alan
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Marion
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
Arlen, you are a Troll. Another brain dead identity. Using a girl's name
increases your suvrvivablity? *ROTFLSTC*
Now be fair!
"Marion" is a name that is occasionally seen for males.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_(given_name)>
Hardly ever.
See that page:

Men

Marion Barber Jr. (born 1959), American former National Football League
player
Marion Barber III (1983–2022), American former National Football League
player, son of the above
Marion Barry (1936–2014), former mayor of Washington, D.C.
Marion M. Bradford (1946–2021), American scientist known for his protein
quantification method
Marion Broadstone (1906–1972), American National Football League player
Marion Butts (born 1966), American National Football League player
Marion Cox (1920–1996), NASCAR car owner
Marion Knight Jr. (born 1965), birth name of Suge Knight, founder of
Death Row Records
Marion Mann (1920–2022), American physician and pathologist
Marion Morrison (1907–1979), birth name of John Wayne, American film actor
Marion Motley (1920–1999), American National Football League and
All-America Football Conference player, member of the Pro Hall of Fame
Marion Parsonnet (1905–1960), American screenwriter
Marion Albert Pruett (1949–1999), American spree killer
Marion Pugh (1919–1976), American National Football League player
Marion Pat Robertson (1930–2023), American televangelist
Marion Mike Rounds (born 1954), U.S. Senator from (and former Governor
of) South Dakota
Marion Silva Fernandes (born 1991), Brazilian footballer known simply as
"Marion"
Marion Spielmann (1858–1948), English journalist and art critic
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de
Jörg Lorenz
2025-01-14 15:16:11 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Alan
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Marion
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
Arlen, you are a Troll. Another brain dead identity. Using a girl's name
increases your suvrvivablity? *ROTFLSTC*
Now be fair!
"Marion" is a name that is occasionally seen for males.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_(given_name)>
Hardly ever.
that proves exactly nothing against *millions of female Marions*
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Arno Welzel
2025-01-14 19:55:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
[...]
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Alan
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_(given_name)>
Hardly ever.
that proves exactly nothing against *millions of female Marions*
And how many of them are on that Wikipedia page? I count 46. So what
does this mean?

Exactly - nothing. I personally know one man named "Marion" and two
named "Andrea". No, these guys are not that popular to be mentioned in
Wikipedia. But assumptions like "hardly any man is ever called Mario or
Andrea" is just plain wrong if you don't know it.
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de
Alan
2025-01-14 22:07:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Arno Welzel
[...]
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Alan
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marion_(given_name)>
Hardly ever.
that proves exactly nothing against *millions of female Marions*
And how many of them are on that Wikipedia page? I count 46. So what
does this mean?
Exactly - nothing. I personally know one man named "Marion" and two
named "Andrea". No, these guys are not that popular to be mentioned in
Wikipedia. But assumptions like "hardly any man is ever called Mario or
Andrea" is just plain wrong if you don't know it.
Exactly.

And in a context where there are so many much more relevant criticisms
to level at "Marion"/Andrew/.../Arlen (the earliest I can remember), why
bring it up at all?
R.Wieser
2025-01-14 15:11:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Arno,
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Hardly ever.
[snip list]

That list shows 17 male "marion"s in 164 years. That comes down to one in
over 9.5 years.

If you remove the earliest and latest dates (as outliers) than it still 116
years, coming down to one in over 6.8 years.

I would say that both are "hardly ever"- especially as that is for the whole
world.

... though the above would hold more weight if it could/would be compared to
one of the more popular names.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Arno Welzel
2025-01-14 19:52:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
Arno,
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Hardly ever.
[snip list]
That list shows 17 male "marion"s in 164 years. That comes down to one in
over 9.5 years.
Yes - for *known* men. Not every man called "Marion" or "Andrea" is
listed in Wikipedia. But even I know to men called "Andrea" and one man
called "Marion" personally.
--
Arno Welzel
https://arnowelzel.de
Frank Slootweg
2025-01-14 20:00:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Arno Welzel
Post by R.Wieser
Arno,
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Hardly ever.
[snip list]
That list shows 17 male "marion"s in 164 years. That comes down to one in
over 9.5 years.
Yes - for *known* men. Not every man called "Marion" or "Andrea" is
listed in Wikipedia. But even I know to men called "Andrea" and one man
called "Marion" personally.
And then there's a boy named Sue.

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Boy_Named_Sue>
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-14 22:11:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
Post by Arno Welzel
Post by R.Wieser
Arno,
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Hardly ever.
[snip list]
That list shows 17 male "marion"s in 164 years. That comes down to one in
over 9.5 years.
Yes - for *known* men. Not every man called "Marion" or "Andrea" is
listed in Wikipedia. But even I know to men called "Andrea" and one man
called "Marion" personally.
And then there's a boy named Sue.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Boy_Named_Sue>
"The song tells the tale of a young man's quest for revenge on a father
who abandoned him at three years of age and whose only contribution to
his entire life was giving him a guitar and naming him Sue, commonly a
feminine name, which results in the young man suffering from ridicule
and harassment by everyone he meets. Ashamed of his name, he becomes a
hard-hearted nomad as a young man; he swears that he will find and kill
his father for giving him "that awful name". "


Couldn't he just change his name? Or his mother do it? Why did his
mother not oppose that name? Why did he not hate his mother?

Argh, me trying to make sense of a song.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
R.Wieser
2025-01-15 06:01:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Arno,
Post by Arno Welzel
Post by R.Wieser
That list shows 17 male "marion"s in 164 years. That comes down to
one in over 9.5 years.
Yes - for *known* men. Not every man called "Marion" or "Andrea" is
listed in Wikipedia.
Agreed. But as you have not shown any correlation between known and unknown
"Marion"s and "Andrea"s you can't extrapolate the "hardly ever" to anything
more.

Heck, if I would apply the iceberg assumption (10% visible, 90% not) than it
still looks to be a rather small number.

Though again, having some other, more popular name to compare against would
be usefull.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Chris
2025-01-15 11:22:39 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
Arno,
Post by Arno Welzel
Post by R.Wieser
That list shows 17 male "marion"s in 164 years. That comes down to
one in over 9.5 years.
Yes - for *known* men. Not every man called "Marion" or "Andrea" is
listed in Wikipedia.
Agreed. But as you have not shown any correlation between known and unknown
"Marion"s and "Andrea"s you can't extrapolate the "hardly ever" to anything
more.
Heck, if I would apply the iceberg assumption (10% visible, 90% not) than it
still looks to be a rather small number.
Though again, having some other, more popular name to compare against would
be usefull.
Fortunately, someone's built an interactive browser:
https://engaging-data.com/baby-name-visualizer/

Marion for a boy peaked in the 1910s with a rate of 763/million.

Contrast with Andrew which peaked in the 1980s with 10x more
(7749/million).

However, note that the overall trend is for all names (in the US) to appear
less frequently as more and more non-traditional names are used.
R.Wieser
2025-01-15 12:23:47 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Chris,
Post by Chris
Marion for a boy peaked in the 1910s with a rate of 763/million.
Contrast with Andrew which peaked in the 1980s with 10x more
(7749/million).
In that case, 1 on 10, its not what I would call "hardly ever" either.

Thanks.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Ken Blake
2025-01-14 16:56:43 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Marion
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
Arlen, you are a Troll. Another brain dead identity. Using a girl's name
increases your suvrvivablity? *ROTFLSTC*
Now be fair!
"Marion" is a name that is occasionally seen for males.
Although I know a woman named Marion, in my experience, Marion is a
name for men and Marian a name for women.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-13 22:22:45 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
Maybe you will learn that you are stupid insulting people
OK. Let's run a simple empirical experiment, shall we?
a. You stop wrongfully accusing me of hiding in the message body
But you do hide. You are constantly changing names in order to confuse
people in thinking you are a new guy instead of old Arlen and evading
kill file filters.
Post by Marion
b. And I'll stop proving that you're a moron by pointing to what you do
Everybody knows you lie and insult when people do not agree with what
you say.
Post by Marion
How's that for a good experiment, Carlos?
A. You immediately stop insulting me (which is what started this tangent).
I have never insulted you. Post the quote.
Post by Marion
B. Then I'll stop responding to your insults (because they won't be there).
Deal?
That way we can get back to kind-hearted purposefully helpful posts.
Jesus Christ Carlos.
What value did you add to this thread that had any semblance of topic?
All you can do is insult people by calling them trolls.
You can't possibly add even a single iota of on-topic value.
In fact, everything from you *subtracts* value from this thread Carlos.
Not reading further. You are a troll. That's not an insult, it is a
FACT. If you do things that trolls do (like change names), then you are
a troll, period.

And about everybody agrees.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
R.Wieser
2025-01-14 06:46:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Carlos,
If you do things that trolls do (like change names), then you are a troll,
period.
If that would be the /only/ thing he would do - so he can't be
(automatically) tracked (by unnamed nasties) as he explains it - than I
would consider it to be his peculiarity. Not always handy, but rather
harmless. The other behaviours he is exhibiting ? Not so much.

And I don't think he's troll - at least not in the definition that he enjoys
the ruckus he's causing. For instance, he's not jumping at stuff a true
(malicious or not) troll would have a field day with, goading his opponents
even further.

Besides, a troll normaly ends with (good-humoured or not) telling/showing
his opponent(s) how they fell for their goading. Instead arlen here just
"fades away".

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-14 12:33:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Carlos,
If you do things that trolls do (like change names), then you are a troll,
period.
If that would be the /only/ thing he would do - so he can't be
(automatically) tracked (by unnamed nasties) as he explains it - than I
would consider it to be his peculiarity. Not always handy, but rather
harmless. The other behaviours he is exhibiting ? Not so much.
And I don't think he's troll - at least not in the definition that he enjoys
the ruckus he's causing. For instance, he's not jumping at stuff a true
(malicious or not) troll would have a field day with, goading his opponents
even further.
Besides, a troll normaly ends with (good-humoured or not) telling/showing
his opponent(s) how they fell for their goading. Instead arlen here just
"fades away".
We would have to discuss types of trolls :-)
I'm not an expert on that.


He claims that he can be found by inspecting his headers and that I'm
stupid for not finding him fast. Is that true, is there a header that
gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Frank Slootweg
2025-01-14 14:26:51 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Carlos E.R. <***@es.invalid> wrote:
[...]

[About 'Arlen':]
Post by Carlos E.R.
He claims that he can be found by inspecting his headers and that I'm
stupid for not finding him fast. Is that true, is there a header that
gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
He changes his story/excuses over the years, but for quite some time
he has been claiming that it should be evident from the *body* (not the
headers) that it's him and that anyone who can not do that within one or
two posts is stupid, etc..

Of course that argument is invalid and also invalidates most other
claims/arguments he makes about his so-called "tutorials".

Identifying him via the headers of his posts is not practical. The
only common factor is that he mostly uses news servers which are
considered more or less rogue, but other people are also using those
servers.

That leaves us with identifying his hundred or so nyms one-by-one and
putting them in our (software or/and mental) filters.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-14 22:05:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
[...]
[About 'Arlen':]
Post by Carlos E.R.
He claims that he can be found by inspecting his headers and that I'm
stupid for not finding him fast. Is that true, is there a header that
gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
He changes his story/excuses over the years, but for quite some time
he has been claiming that it should be evident from the *body* (not the
headers) that it's him and that anyone who can not do that within one or
two posts is stupid, etc..
Of course that argument is invalid and also invalidates most other
claims/arguments he makes about his so-called "tutorials".
Identifying him via the headers of his posts is not practical. The
only common factor is that he mostly uses news servers which are
considered more or less rogue, but other people are also using those
servers.
That leaves us with identifying his hundred or so nyms one-by-one and
putting them in our (software or/and mental) filters.
Right. Confirms my thoughts.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-23 04:03:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
He changes his story/excuses over the years,
Bullshit. I care about privacy. If you don't know that by now, that's YOUR
problem, not mine. It's sad you can't comprehend something that simple.
Post by Frank Slootweg
but for quite some time
he has been claiming that it should be evident from the *body* (not the
headers) that it's him and that anyone who can not do that within one or
two posts is stupid, etc..
Jesus Christ, Frank.

Of all people on this ng, you ran your own NNTP server, and we have
discussed, at length, in the past, that I can change (almost) any header to
whatever I want it to be (as long as it's not injected by the server).

I haven't reacted to Carlos' claims that I said I could easily be located
in robotic scripts by some supposedly cryptic purposefully intruded header
spit - but - the fact is I would never have said something that stupid.

Carlos, in his normal trolling fashion - simply made that up on his own.

The whole point, for God's sake, of munging the *headers* is so that
robotic scripts wouldn't be able to gather my many thousands (or whatever
number there is) of my posts in decades of posting to Usenet & elsewhere.
Post by Frank Slootweg
Of course that argument is invalid and also invalidates most other
claims/arguments he makes about his so-called "tutorials".
Sometimes Frank, you say intelligent things (such as your SMB ports
information) but sometimes you say the dumbest things that make me shake my
head in dismay.

I suspect you are trolling me on your untoward deprecation of my many
hundreds of tutorials over the decades is because you can't write even one.

Those *tutorials* are so detailed that they contain every step, e.g., how
to turn an iPad into a USB stick - which only one person in ten million
knows how to do (my estimate) given there are extremely special tricks
involved when you need to *write* to the entire iOS file system, Frank.

I explain every single step, usually in a cut-and-paste manner, Frank.
Every single step of my tutorials have been tested by me to work, Frank.

That's *why* they're tutorials.

How many tutorials have *you* written, Frank?

HINT: The answer is zero.

The fact that I've added more value in a single tutorial than you have
added in your entire life, Frank, is not lost on me when you deprecate
them.

You're the troll here, by doing that. Not me for responding to you.
Post by Frank Slootweg
Identifying him via the headers of his posts is not practical.
Hint: It should be impossible, although I could munge the headers far more
frequently than I do; but I don't. I munge them when they need to be
munged.

If someone can't tell my posts from the *body* of the post, then I have to
say that they're not all that intelligent - since I don't hide in the body.

Who else posts this kind of detail, Frank, in the body of their articles?
<Loading Image...>

Given the fact that the *body* is obviously mine when it includes those
images, it's sadly hilarious in a sadly poignant way, when people like
Carlos & Jeorg (and others) scream out in ecstatic joy *I FOUND YOU!*.

In fact, every time you or someone else claims *I FOUND YOU!*, I shake my
head in sad dismay since when you do that, you prove your IQ to the world.
R.Wieser
2025-01-14 16:54:10 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Carlos,
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by R.Wieser
Besides, a troll normaly ends with (good-humoured or not) telling/showing
his opponent(s) how they fell for their goading. Instead arlen here just
"fades away".
We would have to discuss types of trolls :-)
I'm not an expert on that.
Luckily(!), neither am I. :-)
Post by Carlos E.R.
He claims that he can be found by inspecting his headers and that I'm
stupid for not finding him fast. Is that true, is there a header that
gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
Not that I know of. Although in this case his (chosen by himself)
"@facts.com" email addy does give a bit of a hint.

Furthermore "marion"s first post(!) containing "they're a moron" was enough
to raise my suspicion, and the complaining about "I figured you out" will
most likely have been a lighthouse signal to the one who made that remark.

Quite a while ago I asked the same to someone here who said he had
experience/knowledge with email and newsgroup headers, and even he said he
could effectivily only make guesses.

Also, being able to just extract the users identity from the newspost
headers would no go well with most of people - including arlen here - and
the newsgroup provider enabeling such a thing would be hemmoraging users
when that would come out in the open.

So no, there isn't anything in there from which you can extract a posters
identity.

However, there is a (likely) possibility that one of those headers contains
a random(sh?) number which, if you have access to the newsgroup-servers
look-up table you could find the number and next to it the identification
the person used to sign up with.

Than again, IIRC until last year I used an newgroup host which didn't ask
for a signup, so the trace would end there.

And do realize that arlen is one of the knights-of-claim-a-lot, meaning that
he seldom, if ever, supports his claims with verifyable data.

There are a few possibilities for his claim :

1) He actually is able to do what he says. Though he's way to eager to show
off what all he can do, so I think we can forget about that.

2) He thinks he noticed a constant or a pattern in those newsgroup-message
headers contents, and concluded that that identifies him - blightely
ignoring that even if we would know where that that constant would be
located in the headers, we would not be able to ascertain who that that
constant belongs to.

3) He's goading you/us with some "I know something you don't so I'm more
important than you!". Which he definitily is the person for.

Last but not least, I've not heard of anyone being able to do what arlen
there has been claiming for years now.
Post by Carlos E.R.
is there a header that gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
Not to my knowledge.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-14 22:05:18 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Carlos,
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by R.Wieser
Besides, a troll normaly ends with (good-humoured or not) telling/showing
his opponent(s) how they fell for their goading. Instead arlen here just
"fades away".
We would have to discuss types of trolls :-)
I'm not an expert on that.
Luckily(!), neither am I. :-)
Post by Carlos E.R.
He claims that he can be found by inspecting his headers and that I'm
stupid for not finding him fast. Is that true, is there a header that
gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
Not that I know of. Although in this case his (chosen by himself)
Right! That's in the name I use for his filter.
Post by Marion
Furthermore "marion"s first post(!) containing "they're a moron" was enough
to raise my suspicion, and the complaining about "I figured you out" will
most likely have been a lighthouse signal to the one who made that remark.
That's true.
Post by Marion
Quite a while ago I asked the same to someone here who said he had
experience/knowledge with email and newsgroup headers, and even he said he
could effectivily only make guesses.
Also, being able to just extract the users identity from the newspost
headers would no go well with most of people - including arlen here - and
the newsgroup provider enabeling such a thing would be hemmoraging users
when that would come out in the open.
So no, there isn't anything in there from which you can extract a posters
identity.
However, there is a (likely) possibility that one of those headers contains
a random(sh?) number which, if you have access to the newsgroup-servers
look-up table you could find the number and next to it the identification
the person used to sign up with.
Yes, of course.
Post by Marion
Than again, IIRC until last year I used an newgroup host which didn't ask
for a signup, so the trace would end there.
And do realize that arlen is one of the knights-of-claim-a-lot, meaning that
he seldom, if ever, supports his claims with verifyable data.
Right.
Post by Marion
1) He actually is able to do what he says. Though he's way to eager to show
off what all he can do, so I think we can forget about that.
2) He thinks he noticed a constant or a pattern in those newsgroup-message
headers contents, and concluded that that identifies him - blightely
ignoring that even if we would know where that that constant would be
located in the headers, we would not be able to ascertain who that that
constant belongs to.
3) He's goading you/us with some "I know something you don't so I'm more
important than you!". Which he definitily is the person for.
Last but not least, I've not heard of anyone being able to do what arlen
there has been claiming for years now.
Right.
Post by Marion
Post by Carlos E.R.
is there a header that gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
Not to my knowledge.
Ok, so I was not missing anything.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
R.Wieser
2025-01-15 20:36:07 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Carlos,
Post by Carlos E.R.
Post by R.Wieser
Post by Carlos E.R.
is there a header that gives him away, or at least rise the suspicions?
Not to my knowledge.
Ok, so I was not missing anything.
That, or all of us here past and present, as well as security-oriented
researchers* are.

* like "Krebs on Security"

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Marion
2025-01-23 04:14:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
I've not heard of anyone being able to do what arlen
there has been claiming for years now.
Rudy,

You are a troll, which is fine, and Carlos is a troll, which is also fine,
but the fact you two are discussing ad infinitum a falsity that Carlos
simply fabricated out of nothing - proves neither of you own a synapse.

If you can't tell, instantly, from the *body* of a message that it's from
me, then I claim that your IQ is so low, nothing you say will ever matter.

If you can't tell that any post with this kind of image is from me, then
nobody on the planet can help you because you're an utter moron, Rudy.
<https://i.postimg.cc/zD0DVSny/debug-20250122-newpipe.jpg>

Rest assured, I'm well aware you & Carlos hate me because I've provided
more on-topic value in one day than you have in your entire lives.

But for you and Carlos to discuss ad infinitum Carlos' ridiculously made up
falsity, simply shows that the two of you are wasting everyone's time here.

You (including Allen, Joerg, Chris, et al.) are the trolls on this ng.
Not me.
Alan
2025-01-23 04:32:54 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
 I've not heard of anyone being able to do what arlen
there has been claiming for years now.
Rudy,
You are a troll, which is fine, and Carlos is a troll, which is also fine,
but the fact you two are discussing ad infinitum a falsity that Carlos
simply fabricated out of nothing - proves neither of you own a synapse.
If you can't tell, instantly, from the *body* of a message that it's from
me, then I claim that your IQ is so low, nothing you say will ever matter.
Except the filters available in Usenet clients can't make that
distinction...

...so you're changing your nym to avoid those.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-23 09:20:35 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
Post by Marion
 I've not heard of anyone being able to do what arlen
there has been claiming for years now.
Rudy,
You are a troll, which is fine, and Carlos is a troll, which is also fine,
but the fact you two are discussing ad infinitum a falsity that Carlos
simply fabricated out of nothing - proves neither of you own a synapse.
If you can't tell, instantly, from the *body* of a message that it's from
me, then I claim that your IQ is so low, nothing you say will ever matter.
Except the filters available in Usenet clients can't make that
distinction...
...so you're changing your nym to avoid those.
Exactly.

It is his claim that we can tell instantly that it is him that made me
wonder.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Marion
2025-01-10 21:15:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Frank Slootweg
In this short subthread he both praised and insulted me,
Frank,

When you teach a class of students, you praise individuals when they say
useful things, and you gently chastise them when they say absurd things.

a. What you term an "insult" simply means you say absurd things.
b. What you term "praise" simply means you sometimes don't.

How I react to you depends on what YOU say, Frank.
I'm extremely consistent.
Post by Frank Slootweg
while I have
not responded to him, not now and not in a long time. Normally he has
some bogus 'explanation' for this inconsistent behaviour of his, but
even that can not apply in this case.
It's extremely consistent Frank.
a. When YOU say absurd things - I disagree with you.
b. When YOU say correct things - I concur.

The only person "inconsistent" here.... is YOU.
Not me.

I've been the same for decades - and that's all the more reason that people
like Carlos who scream out "I found you" are simply proving they're morons.

If it takes you more than one or two posts to figure out mine, then there
is something drastically wrong with you since even my images are the same
over the years - and they're all unique - as nobody posts what I post.
<https://i.postimg.cc/x1BL0M8G/shortcut-location-accuracy04.jpg>

After seeing just one of those, anyone who claims "I'm hiding" from them is
simply stating that they're like the mentally handicapped who claim "I
found it" when they see the Easter egg on the table which is not hidden.
sticks
2025-01-10 23:16:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
I'm extremely consistent.
nope, you nym shyft often.
--
I Stand With Israel!
R.Wieser
2025-01-11 21:19:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Marion,
Post by Marion
How I react to you depends on what YOU say, Frank.
Whohoo, a tautology (read: meaningless statements are meaningless).
Post by Marion
I'm extremely consistent.
Absolutily.

If someone disagrees with you, you insult them by telling them they are
dumb. Full stop.

The only way to keep you from insulting someone is by them agreeing with
/whatever/ you say.

The only one, between your ears, who knows what the truth is is you, and
*only* you.

... even if you cannot support such claims or even just explain them.

... and nonwithstanding your never-ending stream of "gimme, gimme, gimme"
hair-brained questions (with you asking *us* for knowledge *you*, obviously,
do not have - but still we are the "dumb" ones. Go figure).

Kiddo, you are a mental case.

And by the way, hospitals get faster-and-faster with those sex-change
operations, don't they ? Just a week ago you where andrew, and now you are
already up-and-about as marion.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser

p.s
I tried to find one of your tutorials, by using, as you posted it, the
pictures name, its description, and even your old "arlen holder" nym. None
of the search engines I tried returned a hit. Your posting "for posterity"
of your "tutorials" seems to have had a very short shelf life...
Marion
2025-01-12 16:38:38 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
I tried to find one of your tutorials, by using, as you posted it, the
pictures name, its description, and even your old "arlen holder" nym. None
of the search engines I tried returned a hit. Your posting "for posterity"
of your "tutorials" seems to have had a very short shelf life...
Hi Rudy,

I'm trying to get back to kind-hearted writing of helpful tutorials, so
it's not good that people like you & Carlos whine like little girls here.

Your whole life you've been told you are stupid; that statement shows why.
Same with Carlos. You *hate* that you're stupid. So you blame me for that.

To wit, for the iPhone newsgroup:
<https://groups.google.com/g/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/search?q=tutorial%20arlen>

For the Android newsgroup:
<https://groups.google.com/g/comp.mobile.android/search?q=tutorial%20arlen>

For someone to say they can't find the tutorials just means they are
stupid. Yet for you to conclude they don't exist is *why* you're stupid.

For the Windows newsgroup:
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.comp.microsoft.windows/search?q=tutorial%20arlen>

There are so many of them, I can't even find them all myself, Rudy.
But just one page is more added value than you've added your whole life.

For the Linux newsgroup:
<https://groups.google.com/g/alt.os.linux/search?q=tutorial%20arlen>

People like you & Carlos were told by everyone that you're stupid.
The reason is obvious given neither of you has any value to add.

All you can do is whine & cry that everyone is smarter than you are.
Please reply with just one purposefully helpful tutorial you wrote.

Carlos: Respond with just one tutorial that you've written.
Rudy: Same with you. Just one purposefully helpful tutorial you wrote.

Name just one.

Now can we get back to writing kind-hearted helpful tutorials please?
R.Wieser
2025-01-12 20:31:33 UTC
Reply
Permalink
"Marion",
Post by Marion
I'm trying to get back to kind-hearted writing of helpful tutorials, so
it's not good that people like you & Carlos whine like little girls here.
Are you denying that you insult people (and) calling them stupid ?

Are you denying that you copy-pasted something I wrote and tried to make it
sound that I agreed with you about something completely different ?

Are you denying that you claimed that someone who's response did not even
come /near/ your question was the only one who understood your question ?
Post by Marion
Your whole life you've been told you are stupid; that statement shows
why.Same with Carlos. You *hate* that you're stupid. So you blame me for
that.
:-) Kiddo, you are making claims about my life you have no way of knowing.
The only reason you doing it is to convince yourself. You call everyone
dumb because *you* can't cope with the idea that you aren't the smartest
person around, or even in this newsgroup.
Post by Marion
All you can do is whine & cry that everyone is smarter than you are.
I encounter "dumber" and "smarter" people regulary, even in this newsgroup.
Its a fact of life. The first I can, when they ask, help with what I know,
and I can learn from the others.
Post by Marion
Please reply with just one purposefully helpful tutorial you wrote.
If I did, that would help *me* ... how ? And no, your assessment of
what I, or anyone else for that matter, created would be directly suspect,
as you consider yourself the best-of-the-best, no matter what.

Besides, I have no wish to see you butcher something I wrote into one of
those "tutorials" you like(d) to churn out.

I also remember that time where you tried to demand that I should prove my
worth to you - by giving you exactly the answers you needed, and you where
very pushy about it (gee, I wonder why...).

Thats right, this is not the first time you are trying to play this game
with me.

Also, its *you* who measures someones worth by the number of tutorials they
write. I certainly don't.
Post by Marion
Rudy: Same with you. Just one purposefully helpful tutorial you wrote.
I will think of that after I see you post your own first "purposefully
helpful" tutorial.

And no, putting a billboard saying "prime land, ready for house-building" in
the middle of a snake and crocodile swamp does not magically make it so.
Post by Marion
Now can we get back to writing kind-hearted helpful tutorials please?
Beside the problem that most, or not all of them are downright garbage, how
is your "asking that others do all the legwork for impossible "requests" in
any way "kindharted" or even just "helpfull" to them ?

How is your "all of you are dumb!" shrieking the moment someone disagrees
with you in any way "kindharted" or "helpfull" ?

No kiddo, it doesn't even matter if your tutorials where actually upto snuff
when you treat the people from which you get your knowledge that way.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Marion
2025-01-12 22:36:25 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
Also, its *you* who measures someones worth by the number of tutorials they
write. I certainly don't.
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Please reply with just one purposefully helpful tutorial you've written.
Thanks!
R.Wieser
2025-01-13 06:37:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
"Marion".,
Post by Marion
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Ah yes, the famous "I don't like this conversation anymore" evasion attempt.

Kiddo, in my previous reply you've been presented with a number of questions
and rebuttals which you can't/refuse to deal with, and are now trying to
make a run for it. Just like your dropping of your "andrew" nym and coming
back with this "marion" one. Noone has noticed that either, no sirree! /s

Kiddo, you may think you are a smooth operator, but you are *way* to
obvious - even to someone like me.

Than again, you still thinking that you can get away with such shennigans
but me (again) picking up on them might just mean I'm (much) smarter than
you. :-p
Post by Marion
Please reply with just one purposefully helpful tutorial you've written.
[quote= previous reply]
Besides, I have no wish to see you butcher something I wrote into one of
those "tutorials" you like(d) to churn out.

I also remember that time where you tried to demand that I should prove my
worth to you - by giving you exactly the answers you needed, and you where
very pushy about it (gee, I wonder why...).
[/quote]

A rather famous (to me) quote:
"insanity is to do the same thing over-and-over again while expecting
different results".

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Siard
2025-01-13 10:32:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
Post by Marion
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Ah yes, the famous "I don't like this conversation anymore" evasion
attempt. ...etc.
I would certainly welcome an end to all this hate talk.
As far as I can see, 'Marion' has no evil intentions, and everyone has
his peculiarities.
Jörg Lorenz
2025-01-13 17:09:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Siard
Post by R.Wieser
Post by Marion
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Ah yes, the famous "I don't like this conversation anymore" evasion
attempt. ...etc.
I would certainly welcome an end to all this hate talk.
As far as I can see, 'Marion' has no evil intentions, and everyone has
his peculiarities.
I strongly disagree. Marion as she calls herself is an absolute newbie
and tries to guide what is right and what is wrong. One more wrong step
and she disappears in my killfile like all other Arlen-identities.
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Alan
2025-01-13 17:13:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Siard
Post by R.Wieser
Post by Marion
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Ah yes, the famous "I don't like this conversation anymore" evasion
attempt. ...etc.
I would certainly welcome an end to all this hate talk.
As far as I can see, 'Marion' has no evil intentions, and everyone has
his peculiarities.
Then you can't see very far is all I can tell you.
R.Wieser
2025-01-13 19:35:50 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Siard,
Post by Siard
I would certainly welcome an end to all this hate talk.
How is confronting someone with his own bad behaviour "hate talk" ? Is that
some new woke "alternate truth" thing perhaps ?
Post by Siard
As far as I can see, 'Marion' has no evil intentions,
Neither does a zonked out drunkard, but I still don't have to accept him
barfing all over me either.
Post by Siard
and everyone has his peculiarities.
True.

One of "marion"s peculiarities is being abusive toward any-and-everyone who
doesn't agree with him. And I/we do not need to accept that.

Another "peculiarity" of him is to ask/cajole others into doing shitloads of
work for him, stuff he could easily do himself - Which I definitily consider
to be a form of, as you call it, evil.

And do notice that our esteemed "marion" here doesn't (wish to) respond to
pretty-much anything I confront him with. Shall we also white-wash that as
a "peculiarity" ?

Nah, I don't think so.

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-13 22:32:58 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Siard
Post by R.Wieser
Post by Marion
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Ah yes, the famous "I don't like this conversation anymore" evasion
attempt. ...etc.
I would certainly welcome an end to all this hate talk.
As far as I can see, 'Marion' has no evil intentions, and everyone has
his peculiarities.
No evil intentions? How about "her" insults when we don't agree with
"her"? He has been doing that for years.

I can talk with his multiple identities as long as he remains civil.
Which is difficult because changing names is a highly trollish
behaviour. Finding out a new identity puts me in a bad humour.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Chris
2025-01-13 21:31:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
"insanity is to do the same thing over-and-over again while expecting
different results".
Right. So why bother with Marion at all? You are only driving yourself
insane.
R.Wieser
2025-01-14 06:18:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Chris,
Post by Chris
Post by R.Wieser
"insanity is to do the same thing over-and-over again while expecting
different results".
Right. So why bother with Marion at all?
You mean now ? I normally don't, but was named/adressed directly*, and
I've been learned that its anti-social not to respond.

* which kept the converation outof my killfile bin. Normally I don't see
arlens post - up until he changes his nym again.
Post by Chris
You are only driving yourself insane.
What makes you think I'm not already, know it, and consider that to be /my/
"peculiarity" :-)

"They coming to take me away, ha ha, hee hee, ho ho."

Regards,
Rudy Wieser
Chris
2025-01-14 07:37:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by R.Wieser
Chris,
Post by Chris
Post by R.Wieser
"insanity is to do the same thing over-and-over again while expecting
different results".
Right. So why bother with Marion at all?
You mean now ? I normally don't, but was named/adressed directly*, and
I've been learned that its anti-social not to respond.
That's fair. I've done the same in the past.
Post by R.Wieser
* which kept the converation outof my killfile bin. Normally I don't see
arlens post - up until he changes his nym again.
Post by Chris
You are only driving yourself insane.
What makes you think I'm not already, know it, and consider that to be /my/
"peculiarity" :-)
"They coming to take me away, ha ha, hee hee, ho ho."
:)
Jörg Lorenz
2025-01-13 17:05:55 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Marion
Post by R.Wieser
Also, its *you* who measures someones worth by the number of tutorials they
write. I certainly don't.
Can we get back to helping people learn how to use their mobile devices?
Please reply with just one purposefully helpful tutorial you've written.
Thanks!
That is certainly not the purpose of the Usenet, Troll.
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Alan
2025-01-25 20:13:17 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Isaac Montara
Anyone know how existing & new Google, Samsung & Apple phones are faring?
https://energy-efficient-products.ec.europa.eu/product-list/smartphones-
and-tablets_en
1. Resistance to accidental drops or scratches   & protection from dust
& water
2. Sufficiently durable batteries which can withstand   at least 800
charge and discharge cycles   while retaining at least 80% of their
initial capacity
3. Rules on disassembly and repair, including obligations   for
producers to make critical spare parts available   within 5-10 working
days, and for 7 years after
  the end of sales of the product model on the EU market
4. Availability of operating system upgrades for longer periods   (at
least 5 years from the date of the end of placement on   the market of
the last unit of a product model)
5. Non-discriminatory access for professional repairers   to any
software or firmware needed for the replacement
And the mandate for USB C for charging is already about to impact future
innovations:

'Oppo’s next foldable is about as thin as USB-C allows'

<https://www.theverge.com/2025/1/20/24347690/oppo-find-n5-oneplus-open-2-thinnest-usb-c-ipx9>

'Oppo’s upcoming Find N5 foldable phone is barely thicker than its own
USB-C port when unfurled, according to photos released by the company.'
Isaac Montara
2025-01-25 22:39:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
And the mandate for USB C for charging is already about to impact future
Thank your lucky stars that the lightning cable is no longer allowed.

That kind of non-standard "innovation" belongs in the garbage heap.

Besides, Apple hasn't innovated a single iPhone thing since Jobs died.

Well, Apple removed a few things, if you want to call that innovation.
Alan
2025-01-26 00:59:40 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Isaac Montara
Post by Alan
And the mandate for USB C for charging is already about to impact
Thank your lucky stars that the lightning cable is no longer allowed.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
That kind of non-standard "innovation" belongs in the garbage heap.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
Besides, Apple hasn't innovated a single iPhone thing since Jobs died.
Well, Apple removed a few things, if you want to call that innovation.
I notice nothing you say address the substance of what I wrote.
Carlos E.R.
2025-01-26 02:22:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
Post by Isaac Montara
Post by Alan
And the mandate for USB C for charging is already about to impact
Thank your lucky stars that the lightning cable is no longer allowed.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
That kind of non-standard "innovation" belongs in the garbage heap.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
Besides, Apple hasn't innovated a single iPhone thing since Jobs died.
Well, Apple removed a few things, if you want to call that innovation.
I notice nothing you say address the substance of what I wrote.
Notice that Isaac Montara is Arlen, so that is not strange.


Aside that, I wouldn't care less about this particular impact on
innovation :-)
--
Cheers, Carlos.
Isaac Montara
2025-01-26 02:44:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Alan
Post by Isaac Montara
Thank your lucky stars that the lightning cable is no longer allowed.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
That kind of non-standard "innovation" belongs in the garbage heap.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
Besides, Apple hasn't innovated a single iPhone thing since Jobs died.
Well, Apple removed a few things, if you want to call that innovation.
I notice nothing you say address the substance of what I wrote.
Apple making the cable different from all other cables just so that Apple
can sell more lightning cables for their own profit, isn't innovation.
Alan
2025-01-26 03:57:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Post by Isaac Montara
Post by Alan
Post by Isaac Montara
Thank your lucky stars that the lightning cable is no longer allowed.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
That kind of non-standard "innovation" belongs in the garbage heap.
Why?
Post by Isaac Montara
Besides, Apple hasn't innovated a single iPhone thing since Jobs died.
Well, Apple removed a few things, if you want to call that innovation.
I notice nothing you say address the substance of what I wrote.
Apple making the cable different from all other cables just so that Apple
can sell more lightning cables for their own profit, isn't innovation.
Apple didn't "make the cable different from all other cables"...

...because Apple was LEADING THE INDUSTRY.

But you're still not addressing my point (which you've now snipped.
Shocking!).

The EU mandate for USB-C charging ports has just taken effect...

...and we are already seeing a device which pushes the limits of that
mandate.

As long as you imagine that no one could ever make a device any thinner...

...then no problem.

But that's not the way reality works.

The US had a mandate about automobile headlights. And until it was
finally repealed, it held back US cars from getting the better
headlights that were available in other jurisdictions.

Government mandates about technology almost NEVER work.

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