Discussion:
green bubble syndrome
(too old to reply)
badgolferman
2024-10-09 14:30:27 UTC
Permalink
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.

Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.

For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.

Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22
percent — admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage
texts" (e.g., Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning
participants say they don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.

Interestingly, 23 percent of iPhone users get turned off when they
discover that a potential love interest comes up as a green bubble in
their first text conversation, calling it a "dealbreaker."

The survey looked at how male and female participants differed in their
responses. One question asked, "Would it be a dealbreaker for someone
you were interested in to use a non-Apple phone?" Thirty-one percent of
men said yes; 16 percent of women said the same.

The survey discovered that 52 percent of Android users were "made fun
of at some point" by iPhone users for their mobile device; 36 percent
said they were "negatively judged." Twenty-six percent confessed to
feeling embarrassed about their Android device.

Additionally, 30 percent of Android users considered switching due to
peer pressure, the survey revealed.

While there’s some friction between Android and iPhone users, the
survey found that both camps are seek equal footing by exploring more
seamless messaging platforms (e.g., WhatsApp).

Forty-two percent said yes when asked, "Have you ever switched to a
third-party messaging app to accommodate non-iOS users?"

While Apple hasn't shown any indication that it will drop the green
bubbles any time soon, the Cupertino-based tech giant now supports RCS
messaging (also known as Rich Communication Services) in Messages with
the launch of iOS 18.

Without RCS Messaging support, Android and iPhone users experienced
some foibles while messaging each other. For example, videos and
pictures appeared blurry and low-quality due to heavy media
compression. Plus, there are no read receipts nor typing indicators.
However, as mentioned, that is now changing with iOS 18.

Expect higher-quality media sharing and other modern messaging features
between iPhone and Android users, thanks to iOS 18. The only thing that
won't be featured with iPhone-supported RCS is end-to-end encryption,
though the GSM Association (Global System for Mobile Communications),
which is at the helm of the RCS standard, is working to bring
end-to-end encryption to both mobile operating systems.

https://mashable.com/article/iphone-users-think-less-of-android-users-green-bubbles
--
"The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the
strong." ~ Gandhi
Wilf
2024-10-09 18:20:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22
percent — admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage
texts" (e.g., Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning
participants say they don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.
Interestingly, 23 percent of iPhone users get turned off when they
discover that a potential love interest comes up as a green bubble in
their first text conversation, calling it a "dealbreaker."
The survey looked at how male and female participants differed in their
responses. One question asked, "Would it be a dealbreaker for someone
you were interested in to use a non-Apple phone?" Thirty-one percent of
men said yes; 16 percent of women said the same.
The survey discovered that 52 percent of Android users were "made fun
of at some point" by iPhone users for their mobile device; 36 percent
said they were "negatively judged." Twenty-six percent confessed to
feeling embarrassed about their Android device.
Additionally, 30 percent of Android users considered switching due to
peer pressure, the survey revealed.
While there’s some friction between Android and iPhone users, the
survey found that both camps are seek equal footing by exploring more
seamless messaging platforms (e.g., WhatsApp).
Forty-two percent said yes when asked, "Have you ever switched to a
third-party messaging app to accommodate non-iOS users?"
While Apple hasn't shown any indication that it will drop the green
bubbles any time soon, the Cupertino-based tech giant now supports RCS
messaging (also known as Rich Communication Services) in Messages with
the launch of iOS 18.
Without RCS Messaging support, Android and iPhone users experienced
some foibles while messaging each other. For example, videos and
pictures appeared blurry and low-quality due to heavy media
compression. Plus, there are no read receipts nor typing indicators.
However, as mentioned, that is now changing with iOS 18.
Expect higher-quality media sharing and other modern messaging features
between iPhone and Android users, thanks to iOS 18. The only thing that
won't be featured with iPhone-supported RCS is end-to-end encryption,
though the GSM Association (Global System for Mobile Communications),
which is at the helm of the RCS standard, is working to bring
end-to-end encryption to both mobile operating systems.
https://mashable.com/article/iphone-users-think-less-of-android-users-green-bubbles
How ridiculous. I enjoy my iPhone but don't understand why someone
might feel superior to another just because they can or cannot use
iMessage. Sheesh!
--
Wilf
Jolly Roger
2024-10-09 23:41:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
How ridiculous. I enjoy my iPhone but don't understand why someone
might feel superior to another just because they can or cannot use
iMessage. Sheesh!
I wouldn't consider it to be representative of all or even most iPhone
users. The survey was of 1000 U.S. adults, some questions were limited
to only iPhone / Android users, and they don't say anything about how
those people were selected.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Jörg Lorenz
2024-10-10 07:08:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Wilf
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
How ridiculous. I enjoy my iPhone but don't understand why someone
might feel superior to another just because they can or cannot use
iMessage. Sheesh!
I wouldn't consider it to be representative of all or even most iPhone
users. The survey was of 1000 U.S. adults, some questions were limited
to only iPhone / Android users, and they don't say anything about how
those people were selected.
In other words: Total crap and a waste of money.
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Jörg Lorenz
2024-10-09 20:24:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22
percent — admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage
texts" (e.g., Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning
participants say they don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.
Interestingly, 23 percent of iPhone users get turned off when they
discover that a potential love interest comes up as a green bubble in
their first text conversation, calling it a "dealbreaker."
The survey looked at how male and female participants differed in their
responses. One question asked, "Would it be a dealbreaker for someone
you were interested in to use a non-Apple phone?" Thirty-one percent of
men said yes; 16 percent of women said the same.
The survey discovered that 52 percent of Android users were "made fun
of at some point" by iPhone users for their mobile device; 36 percent
said they were "negatively judged." Twenty-six percent confessed to
feeling embarrassed about their Android device.
Additionally, 30 percent of Android users considered switching due to
peer pressure, the survey revealed.
While there’s some friction between Android and iPhone users, the
survey found that both camps are seek equal footing by exploring more
seamless messaging platforms (e.g., WhatsApp).
Forty-two percent said yes when asked, "Have you ever switched to a
third-party messaging app to accommodate non-iOS users?"
While Apple hasn't shown any indication that it will drop the green
bubbles any time soon, the Cupertino-based tech giant now supports RCS
messaging (also known as Rich Communication Services) in Messages with
the launch of iOS 18.
Without RCS Messaging support, Android and iPhone users experienced
some foibles while messaging each other. For example, videos and
pictures appeared blurry and low-quality due to heavy media
compression. Plus, there are no read receipts nor typing indicators.
However, as mentioned, that is now changing with iOS 18.
Expect higher-quality media sharing and other modern messaging features
between iPhone and Android users, thanks to iOS 18. The only thing that
won't be featured with iPhone-supported RCS is end-to-end encryption,
though the GSM Association (Global System for Mobile Communications),
which is at the helm of the RCS standard, is working to bring
end-to-end encryption to both mobile operating systems.
https://mashable.com/article/iphone-users-think-less-of-android-users-green-bubbles
Something is definitely wrong. If I add all these percentages up,
200-300% of all Android-users must have a severe complex and be totally
depressive and socially handicapped. What a disaster!

*SCNR*
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Your Name
2024-10-09 21:35:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>

Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What a
cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing actually
meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\

Plus, if they were truly "adults" they wouldn't give a flying crap
about the colour of a message bubble on a mobile phone screen.
Obviously what these idiots really pointlessly surveyed were some
teenagers at a local shopping mall.
Chris
2024-10-10 06:25:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What a
cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing actually
meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand ppl is a
good sized survey.
Jörg Lorenz
2024-10-10 07:12:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What a
cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing actually
meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand ppl is a
good sized survey.
No it isn't. Statistically it is totally irrelevant.
The interpretation of these low quality results is simply impossible
because the structure of the chosen sample is unknown (Age, gender,
income, regional aspects etc etc.).
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Chris
2024-10-11 19:17:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What a
cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing actually
meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand ppl is a
good sized survey.
No it isn't. Statistically it is totally irrelevant.
The interpretation of these low quality results is simply impossible
because the structure of the chosen sample is unknown (Age, gender,
income, regional aspects etc etc.).
Hence why I said "if done correctly". You don't have evidence that the
sampling was done incorrectly. So you calling them "low quality" is simply
a reflection of your own bias.
Jörg Lorenz
2024-10-11 21:11:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What a
cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing actually
meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand ppl is a
good sized survey.
No it isn't. Statistically it is totally irrelevant.
The interpretation of these low quality results is simply impossible
because the structure of the chosen sample is unknown (Age, gender,
income, regional aspects etc etc.).
Hence why I said "if done correctly". You don't have evidence that the
sampling was done incorrectly. So you calling them "low quality" is simply
a reflection of your own bias.
Nonsense. Like always. I stick to what Sir Winston Churchill said about
statistics. And btw: As a matter of fact it is not me who hast to prove
the statistic or the methodology is wrong, they have to prove they did
the survey correctly and the result is meaningful.
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Jolly Roger
2024-10-12 00:45:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as a
green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults
in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing
actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
No it isn't. Statistically it is totally irrelevant. The
interpretation of these low quality results is simply impossible
because the structure of the chosen sample is unknown (Age, gender,
income, regional aspects etc etc.).
Hence why I said "if done correctly". You don't have evidence that the
sampling was done incorrectly.
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-12 14:22:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as a
green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults
in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing
actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
No it isn't. Statistically it is totally irrelevant. The
interpretation of these low quality results is simply impossible
because the structure of the chosen sample is unknown (Age, gender,
income, regional aspects etc etc.).
Hence why I said "if done correctly". You don't have evidence that the
sampling was done incorrectly.
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.

This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.

You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.

Over to you...
sticks
2024-10-12 14:29:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
Hilarious.
--
I Stand With Israel!
Alan Browne
2024-10-12 15:27:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.

If such does not come forth, then the survey is useless as presented for
the purpose presented and the audience here.

Can we abandon this subject please?
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Chris
2024-10-12 17:34:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/

I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
Post by Alan Browne
If such does not come forth, then the survey is useless as presented for
the purpose presented and the audience here.
Can we abandon this subject please?
We can...
badgolferman
2024-10-12 19:01:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
Exactly. This is the point no one seems to understand. And it was an
anonymous survey.
*Hemidactylus*
2024-10-12 21:34:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
Post by Chris
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
Exactly. This is the point no one seems to understand. And it was an
anonymous survey.
You brought it up. Why? I have no idea.

My preference for iMessage over Android was the feedback on whether a
message was received, read, or the ellipsis that someone is typing.
Recently, with RCS (I think) or whatever there is more feedback on such
things. That’s an improvement.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:46:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by *Hemidactylus*
Post by badgolferman
Post by Chris
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
Exactly. This is the point no one seems to understand. And it was an
anonymous survey.
You brought it up. Why? I have no idea.
Axe to grind. 😉
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:46:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
Post by Chris
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
Exactly. This is the point no one seems to understand. And it was an
anonymous survey.
Everyone here understands this. Swing and a miss...
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Alan Browne
2024-10-12 21:20:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.

Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").

Pollfish still get:

- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).

Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).

IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.

Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Chris
2024-10-12 22:24:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.

Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Alan Browne
2024-10-13 00:06:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.

This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:51:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing the troll who are being
disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied get punished for standing
up to the bullies. 🤣
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Alan Browne
2024-10-13 22:51:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing the troll who are being
disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied get punished for standing
up to the bullies. 🤣
The troll in question is too weak to be categorized "bully". He's
really just the little dog wagging its tail for approval from the big dog.
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
badgolferman
2024-10-14 00:33:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing the troll who are being
disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied get punished for standing
up to the bullies. 🤣
The troll in question is too weak to be categorized "bully". He's
really just the little dog wagging its tail for approval from the big dog.
Thank you for demonstrating very nicely the snootiness of the type of
iPhone users which this survey highlighted.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-14 16:53:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing the troll who are being
disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied get punished for standing
up to the bullies. 🤣
The troll in question is too weak to be categorized "bully". He's
really just the little dog wagging its tail for approval from the big dog.
Thank you for demonstrating very nicely the snootiness of the type of
iPhone users which this survey highlighted.
Recognizing low-level trolls is being "snooty". You heard it here first!
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Jolly Roger
2024-10-14 16:52:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing the troll who are being
disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied get punished for standing
up to the bullies. 🤣
The troll in question is too weak to be categorized "bully". He's
really just the little dog wagging its tail for approval from the big dog.
Yeah, that's typical of badgolferman.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-14 07:43:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to interpretation and none
are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion? Simply
not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced beginning,
however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing
There's been no scrutiny. It's all been knee-jerk reactions from an
entrenched position.
Post by Jolly Roger
the troll who are being
disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied get punished for standing
up to the bullies. 🤣
Playing the victim is a new low for you...
Jolly Roger
2024-10-14 16:56:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into
some depth to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to
interpretation and none are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion?
Simply not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced
beginning, however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing
There's been no scrutiny. It's all been knee-jerk reactions from an
entrenched position.
That's a lie. Expecting to know more about the poll than the pollsters
divulged isn't a knee-jerk reaction, nor is learning and disseminating
that the pollsters actually pay participants, nor is pointing out that
the sample may not be applicable to the entire population.
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
the troll who are being disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied
get punished for standing up to the bullies. 🤣
Playing the victim is a new low for you...
Projection.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-14 20:10:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into
some depth to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to
interpretation and none are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion?
Simply not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced
beginning, however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing
There's been no scrutiny. It's all been knee-jerk reactions from an
entrenched position.
That's a lie. Expecting to know more about the poll than the pollsters
divulged isn't a knee-jerk reaction,
It is when you're only interested because you don't like the result.
Post by Jolly Roger
nor is learning and disseminating
that the pollsters actually pay participants,
Not unusual.
Post by Jolly Roger
nor is pointing out that
the sample may not be applicable to the entire population.
All samples "may not be applicable", that's inherent in statistical
sampling. What additional information can you add beyond that?
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
the troll who are being disparaged. It's like clockwork. The bullied
get punished for standing up to the bullies. 🤣
Playing the victim is a new low for you...
Projection.
Denial.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-16 01:50:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into
some depth to try and find flaws. Of which, most are open to
interpretation and none are unique to this org.
Why so desperate to find flaws when wanting to end the discussion?
Simply not responding would be easier.
Can't argue with you on that, other than the "depth" of my flaw search.
This whole subject was patently flawed from its troll induced
beginning, however.
And as usual, it's the people scrutinizing
There's been no scrutiny. It's all been knee-jerk reactions from an
entrenched position.
That's a lie. Expecting to know more about the poll than the pollsters
divulged isn't a knee-jerk reaction,
It is when you're only interested because you don't like the result.
I haven't stated anything like that. More dishonesty on display. You're
trolling.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:50:22 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Post by Chris
Simply not responding would be easier.
And now you're telling others to shut up because you dislike where the
discussion is going...
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-14 13:20:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
I have literally stated the opposite.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Again, I don't care about the actual result. It's the low-quality attempts
to rebut the OP is what I care about.

Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Simply not responding would be easier.
And now you're telling others to shut up because you dislike where the
discussion is going...
English comprehension is also a problem, it seems.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-14 16:52:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
I have literally stated the opposite.
Then you're talking out o both sides of your mouth.
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Again, I don't care about the actual result. It's the low-quality attempts
to rebut the OP is what I care about.
Sure.
Post by Chris
Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
Now you're just outright lying. Various other aspects of this poll have
been discussed including the fact that the methodology isn't stated, nor
how participants were selected, and the fact that the polling company
actually pays participants. Why lie? It has to be due to bias on your
part.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-14 20:05:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
I have literally stated the opposite.
Then you're talking out o both sides of your mouth.
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Again, I don't care about the actual result. It's the low-quality attempts
to rebut the OP is what I care about.
Sure.
Post by Chris
Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
Now you're just outright lying. Various other aspects of this poll have
been discussed including the fact that the methodology isn't stated, nor
how participants were selected, and the fact that the polling company
actually pays participants.
You're just asking baseless questions. None of them are clear evidence of
unreliability.
Post by Jolly Roger
Why lie? It has to be due to bias on your
part.
No lies here.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-16 01:48:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
Now you're just outright lying. Various other aspects of this poll have
been discussed including the fact that the methodology isn't stated, nor
how participants were selected, and the fact that the polling company
actually pays participants.
You're just asking baseless questions.
No, we're all having a discussion, and you are objecting to anyone who
voices criticism of the poll or whether it applies to most iPhone users.
Post by Chris
No lies here.
Your above statement is indeed a lie.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Alan Browne
2024-10-14 19:13:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
I have literally stated the opposite.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Again, I don't care about the actual result. It's the low-quality attempts
to rebut the OP is what I care about.
The OP is a proven troll enabler/supporter in its primary roll and low
level troll in its secondary roll.
Post by Chris
Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
So despite it turning into a hash, you're fanning the flames?
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Chris
2024-10-14 20:02:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
I have literally stated the opposite.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Again, I don't care about the actual result. It's the low-quality attempts
to rebut the OP is what I care about.
The OP is a proven troll enabler/supporter in its primary roll and low
level troll in its secondary roll.
I don't think he is. From where I'm sitting JR and JL are the trolls.

Why do you respond to a "proven troll", if that's what you genuinely
believe?
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
So despite it turning into a hash, you're fanning the flames?
I'm not encouraging anyone. If people aren't willing to defend their
assertions without making it personal, then I'm not the issue the here.
badgolferman
2024-10-14 21:30:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
The OP is a proven troll enabler/supporter in its primary roll and
low level troll in its secondary roll.
I don't think he is. From where I'm sitting JR and JL are the trolls.
Why do you respond to a "proven troll", if that's what you genuinely
believe?
Now you've down it! You've sided with Jolly Roger's "proven troll" so
that automatically makes you a "proven troll" to Jolly Roger now.

It's about time others started calling out Jolly Roger for his baseless
assertions, personal attacks, and lying manipulation of what others
say. The very idea that I am a bully is quite laughable. If you want
to see a bully in action just watch Jolly Roger.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-16 01:53:53 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
The OP is a proven troll enabler/supporter in its primary roll and
low level troll in its secondary roll.
I don't think he is. From where I'm sitting JR and JL are the trolls.
Why do you respond to a "proven troll", if that's what you genuinely
believe?
Now you've down it! You've sided with Jolly Roger's "proven troll" so
that automatically makes you a "proven troll" to Jolly Roger now.
Chris is on record lying about what was said in this thread and
dishonestly trying to put words in my mouth. If it walks like a duck and
quacks like a duck, it's a duck.
Post by badgolferman
It's about time others started calling out Jolly Roger for his baseless
assertions, personal attacks, and lying manipulation of what others
say. The very idea that I am a bully is quite laughable. If you want
to see a bully in action just watch Jolly Roger.
Nice victim card, Sparky.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Alan Browne
2024-10-15 14:00:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey. The website used a
professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them more than JR's random
anecdotes or poor maths skills.
A little research into them indicates they are not so much
"professional" pollsters, but a monetization and personal data gathering
platform owned by online marketing co. Prodege.
Amongst complaints is they run "pay the pollee" programs where the
person responding to the poll is paid for completing a set of questions.
However, there is a "quality gate" that measures how long you take per
answer to throw out people who are "too fast". Many people complain of
getting to the end (pollfish get the data) and then the people are
thrown out under an excuse ("too fast!").
- data (survey)
- identifying data (the pollee) to monetize elsewhere.
- client money (who wants the survey done).
Of course clients looking for a desired outcome usually influence how
the questions are formulated, what the questions are (and aren't).
IOW - not a polling organization so much as a money grab.
Paying people to respond to a poll already indicates a skewed poll pool.
For someone wishing to end the discussion you've gone quite into some depth
to try and find flaws.
Whereas you have stated you blindly trust their results without question.
I have literally stated the opposite.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Why so desperate to find flaws
Why so desperate to push low-quality information?
Again, I don't care about the actual result. It's the low-quality attempts
to rebut the OP is what I care about.
The OP is a proven troll enabler/supporter in its primary roll and low
level troll in its secondary roll.
I don't think he is. From where I'm sitting JR and JL are the trolls.
No. Their fault is however engagement with the trolls, alas.
Post by Chris
Why do you respond to a "proven troll", if that's what you genuinely
believe?
Show me where I've replied to it in the recent year? And yes, the OP is
a troll. Perhaps low key and passive aggressive but a troll
nonetheless. Indeed a couple years ago when I proposed an ignorance
campaign (as we did in August) it was protesting the notion and labeling
others as trolls. Projection.
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Despite being on this for days none of you has got anything better than
"dis numba small" vs "dis numba big" as an argument against the OP.
So despite it turning into a hash, you're fanning the flames?
I'm not encouraging anyone. If people aren't willing to defend their
assertions without making it personal, then I'm not the issue the here.
Since it's going in circles, best to abandon.
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:45:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
You are welcome to disagree with it, but if you want to make an
unsubstantiated claim that it is meaningless the onus is now on you.
The burden is with the survey "maker" to publish method, selection, etc.
for peer review.
This isn't a scientific study. It's a survey.
That's glaringly obvious to anyone with a room temperature IQ, me
thinks.
Post by Chris
The website used a professional outfit called pollfish.
https://www.pollfish.com/
It's just a polling website. 🤣
Post by Chris
I don't know them, but on balance I trust them
Blind trust is not a good look.
Post by Chris
more than JR's random anecdotes or poor maths skills.
Baseless insults show your true bias.
Post by Chris
Post by Alan Browne
If such does not come forth, then the survey is useless as presented for
the purpose presented and the audience here.
Can we abandon this subject please?
We can...
Your damned right we can. Will the trolls follow suit?
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:42:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as
a green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous
adults in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely
nothing actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result".
:-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
No it isn't. Statistically it is totally irrelevant. The
interpretation of these low quality results is simply impossible
because the structure of the chosen sample is unknown (Age, gender,
income, regional aspects etc etc.).
Hence why I said "if done correctly". You don't have evidence that
the sampling was done incorrectly.
No. That's not how the burden of proof works. The person (or in this
case, the website) making the claim is responsible for proving their
methodology is sound. And absent of that proof, the rest of us are
completely within our right to disregard it as baseless. This really
shouldn't need to be explained to educated adults, but here we are.
You've completely misapplied burden of proof.
This isn't an unsubstantiated claim where burden of proof would apply.
There is proof/evidence here: the result of the survey.
Yes, and I am questioning that this survey is representative of most
or all iPhone users. Without any insight into how the survey was
conducted, there's no evidence it is.
Post by Chris
if you want to make an unsubstantiated claim
I haven't done that here.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Jolly Roger
2024-10-10 16:28:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining
it. According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some
iPhone users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble
while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's
a better device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed
into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What
a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing
actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand ppl
is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
The article also tells nothing about how these people were selected or
approached for questioning - but you're certain the outcome is relevant?
Do you work for a circus, by chance?

I know many people who use iPhones. I don't know any of them who think
less of anyone simply due to what kind of phone they happen to use.And
while I realize this is anecdotal, I find it hard to believe a
significant number of iPhone users even care about such a trivial thing.
This whole thing smacks of anti-intellectual tribalism (aka zealotry)
being pushed by trolls.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Wilf
2024-10-11 09:51:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
--
Wilf
Jolly Roger
2024-10-11 15:40:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole population
can be statistically significant. So just because someone has no
background in statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the
premise.
Again, they tell us nothing about how these people were selected or
approached for this survey. And I disagree that you should not be
critical of data like this - especially when it doesn't seem to reflect
opinions of other small samplings of iPhone users.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Wilf
2024-10-12 13:45:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole population
can be statistically significant. So just because someone has no
background in statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the
premise.
Again, they tell us nothing about how these people were selected or
approached for this survey. And I disagree that you should not be
critical of data like this - especially when it doesn't seem to reflect
opinions of other small samplings of iPhone users.
Of course its very sensible to be sceptical about how the sample was
chosen etc., my point is that just because the sample size is small does
not in itself invalidate it.
--
Wilf
Alan Browne
2024-10-12 14:21:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant?  Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole population
can be statistically significant.  So just because someone has no
background in statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the
premise.
Again, they tell us nothing about how these people were selected or
approached for this survey. And I disagree that you should not be
critical of data like this - especially when it doesn't seem to reflect
opinions of other small samplings of iPhone users.
Of course its very sensible to be sceptical about how the sample was
chosen etc., my point is that just because the sample size is small does
not in itself invalidate it.
That isn't the only "quality" required of a sampling.

I propose that this thread be abandoned as fruitless.
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Chris
2024-10-11 19:11:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
Correct.
Jörg Lorenz
2024-10-11 21:14:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
Correct.
No. It is not correct by any means.
I still lack the proof that the sample is relevant.
--
"Roma locuta, causa finita." (Augustinus)
Wilf
2024-10-12 13:46:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Chris
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
Correct.
No. It is not correct by any means.
I still lack the proof that the sample is relevant.
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
--
Wilf
Your Name
2024-10-12 21:44:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Chris
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
Correct.
No. It is not correct by any means.
I still lack the proof that the sample is relevant.
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
The results are only valid for the 1000 people they bothered to survey.
Claiming anything above that is pure nonsense and at best simply a very
rough guesstimate.

Such surveys should always specifically say something like "40% of the
people surveyed" ... *NOT* *EVER* simply "40% of people", because
that's where the novice general public then confuses it with being
reality for everyone, when it is not.
Chris
2024-10-12 22:24:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by Wilf
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Chris
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
Correct.
No. It is not correct by any means.
I still lack the proof that the sample is relevant.
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
The results are only valid for the 1000 people they bothered to survey.
Claiming anything above that is pure nonsense and at best simply a very
rough guesstimate.
Do you think the same of election polling?
badgolferman
2024-10-12 23:24:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by Wilf
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by Chris
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant. So just because someone has no background in
statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the premise.
Correct.
No. It is not correct by any means.
I still lack the proof that the sample is relevant.
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
The results are only valid for the 1000 people they bothered to survey.
Claiming anything above that is pure nonsense and at best simply a very
rough guesstimate.
Such surveys should always specifically say something like "40% of the
people surveyed" ... *NOT* *EVER* simply "40% of people", because
that's where the novice general public then confuses it with being
reality for everyone, when it is not.
The article says exactly that!


For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in July
2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.

Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22 percent
— admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage texts" (e.g.,
Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning participants say they
don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.
Jörg Lorenz
2024-10-13 05:27:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
The article says exactly that!
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in July
2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22 percent
— admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage texts" (e.g.,
Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning participants say they
don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.
In essence you are telling us this survey is meaningless crap.
--
"Gutta cavat lapidem." (Ovid)
badgolferman
2024-10-13 11:31:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jörg Lorenz
Post by badgolferman
The article says exactly that!
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in July
2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22 percent
— admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage texts" (e.g.,
Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning participants say they
don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.
In essence you are telling us this survey is meaningless crap.
No, I’m telling you that you and everyone else jumped to conclusions
assuming it was a study rather than an anonymous survey. This survey is as
relevant as any other survey conducted, much like political ones that
candidates live and die by.
Wilf
2024-10-13 12:14:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by Wilf
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
The results are only valid for the 1000 people they bothered to survey.
Claiming anything above that is pure nonsense and at best simply a very
rough guesstimate.
Such surveys should always specifically say something like "40% of the
people surveyed" ...NOT EVER simply "40% of people", because
that's where the novice general public then confuses it with being
reality for everyone, when it is not.
Evidently you have not studied statistics.
--
Wilf
Your Name
2024-10-13 21:16:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Your Name
Post by Wilf
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
The results are only valid for the 1000 people they bothered to survey.
Claiming anything above that is pure nonsense and at best simply a very
rough guesstimate.
Such surveys should always specifically say something like "40% of the
people surveyed" ...NOT EVER simply "40% of people", because
that's where the novice general public then confuses it with being
reality for everyone, when it is not.
Evidently you have not studied statistics.
As I said before, I have a university degree in mathematics and
statistics. I know full well all about the incredible misuse of
statistics and the blind belief by the general public whenever they see
a % symbol.
Chris
2024-10-13 22:13:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Your Name
Post by Wilf
Post by Your Name
Post by Wilf
That's my point. We have to be persuaded that the sample was properly
chosen. Beyond that, the relatively small sample size does not in
itself invalidate the significance of the results.
The results are only valid for the 1000 people they bothered to survey.
Claiming anything above that is pure nonsense and at best simply a very
rough guesstimate.
Such surveys should always specifically say something like "40% of the
people surveyed" ...NOT EVER simply "40% of people", because
that's where the novice general public then confuses it with being
reality for everyone, when it is not.
Evidently you have not studied statistics.
As I said before, I have a university degree in mathematics and
statistics.
Am somewhat stunned. Given your above statement.
Post by Your Name
I know full well all about the incredible misuse of
statistics and the blind belief by the general public whenever they see
a % symbol.
Your Name
2024-10-11 22:16:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole population
can be statistically significant. So just because someone has no
background in statistics is a not a reason to necessarily doubt the
premise.
As a mathematics and statistics graduate, I can tell you for a fact
that the "premise" is utter crap. Statistics are massively misused,
especially when it comes to idiotic surveys.

Surveying a small proportion of the total does not and cannot give you
any meaningful results. At best it can give you a very rough
approximation, but in reality can be way out. Such results *MUST* be
reported as being for only the surveyed people. It's moronic and
misleading to survey only 1000 people and then claim the results are
true for the entire planet - the results are only ever true for those
1000 people!

Try measuring 1000 randomly cut pieces of string and then claiming
every piece of string in the world is Xcm long or even has an average
of Ycm long. It's utter nonsense.

Plus, it gets even worse with ridiculous things like "health studies",
where they not only survery a tiny number of people, but they also
usually completely ignore any other possible factors except the one or
two they're interested in.
Alan Browne
2024-10-11 22:38:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Jolly Roger
2024-10-12 00:53:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole
population can be statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
He does not. If that were known, we wouldn't be having this
conversation.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Wilf
2024-10-12 13:49:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole
population can be statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
He does not. If that were known, we wouldn't be having this
conversation.
Indeed so - I've made my point that I know nothing about how the sample
was chosen - it might be good, it might be bad. My point, again, is
that the small sample size does not in itself invalidate the result.
--
Wilf
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:38:41 UTC
Permalink
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000
goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole
population can be statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
He does not. If that were known, we wouldn't be having this
conversation.
Indeed so - I've made my point that I know nothing about how the
sample was chosen - it might be good, it might be bad. My point,
again, is that the small sample size does not in itself invalidate the
result.
Right. It's all of the other unknowns that invalidate them.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Wilf
2024-10-13 20:24:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000
goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part),
results from a small but representative sample of the whole
population can be statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
He does not. If that were known, we wouldn't be having this
conversation.
Indeed so - I've made my point that I know nothing about how the
sample was chosen - it might be good, it might be bad. My point,
again, is that the small sample size does not in itself invalidate the
result.
Right. It's all of the other unknowns that invalidate them.
Is it? If you can assert so, then they cannot be "unknown" to you.
--
Wilf
badgolferman
2024-10-12 01:18:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
The respondents were anonymous. How do you propose they publish the user
sample?

———-

Methodology

To collect the data for this survey, our team at All About Cookies surveyed
1,000 U.S. adults in July 2024 via Pollfish. All respondents were U.S.
citizens over the age of 18 and remained anonymous.

https://allaboutcookies.org/apple-vs-android
Alan
2024-10-12 17:31:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by badgolferman
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
The respondents were anonymous. How do you propose they publish the user
sample?
———-
Methodology
To collect the data for this survey, our team at All About Cookies surveyed
1,000 U.S. adults in July 2024 via Pollfish. All respondents were U.S.
citizens over the age of 18 and remained anonymous.
https://allaboutcookies.org/apple-vs-android
You omitted this text about the survey:

'We receive compensation from the products and services mentioned in
this story,'
Wilf
2024-10-12 13:47:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Browne
Post by Wilf
Post by Jolly Roger
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
If the sample is chosen properly (and that's the critical part), results
from a small but representative sample of the whole population can be
statistically significant.
Do you have evidence that the sample pop was chosen properly?
No and I'm not trying to support it. All I'm saying is that the small
size of the sample does not in itself invalidate the result. Sure, the
sample has to be properly chosen.
--
Wilf
Chris
2024-10-11 19:21:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining
it. According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some
iPhone users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble
while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's
a better device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed
into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users? What
a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing
actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand ppl
is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024), and
you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is significant?
Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes into 2.5 billion?
You're doing a numerical comparison not a statistical one. Population
samples which are tiny fractions of the whole can be very reliable. There
is a whole scientific field of statistical sampling.
Post by Jolly Roger
The article also tells nothing about how these people were selected or
approached for questioning - but you're certain the outcome is relevant?
I explicitly said I wasn't certain. Note the "if".

You, however, are certain they are not relevant based on literally no
evidence other than dumb maths.
Post by Jolly Roger
Do you work for a circus, by chance?
I know many people who use iPhones. I don't know any of them who think
less of anyone simply due to what kind of phone they happen to use.
Lol. You are literally arguing that your tiny n of a highly biased set is
more significant than when n = 1000 in a formal survey. jfc.
Post by Jolly Roger
And
while I realize this is anecdotal, I find it hard to believe
Well done for revealing your internal bias.
Post by Jolly Roger
a
significant number of iPhone users even care about such a trivial thing.
This whole thing smacks of anti-intellectual tribalism (aka zealotry)
being pushed by trolls.
The only evidence of "anti-intellectual tribalism" is coming from you.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-12 00:53:07 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as a
green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults
in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing
actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
You're doing a numerical comparison not a statistical one.
A meaningless distinction since we know nothing at all about the
methodology used in this survey.
Post by Chris
Population samples which are tiny fractions of the whole can be very
reliable. There is a whole scientific field of statistical sampling.
Again, there's no evidence any scientific method was used here. If there
was, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
The article also tells nothing about how these people were selected
or approached for questioning - but you're certain the outcome is
relevant?
I explicitly said I wasn't certain. Note the "if".
Neither am I, which is in fact the entire point.
Post by Chris
You, however, are certain they are not relevant based on literally no
evidence other than dumb maths.
No, in fact my doubts are based on the lack of evidence. And that's how
science actually works.
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Do you work for a circus, by chance?
I know many people who use iPhones. I don't know any of them who
think less of anyone simply due to what kind of phone they happen to
use.
Lol. You are literally arguing that your tiny n of a highly biased set
is more significant than when n = 1000 in a formal survey. jfc.
I know, work with and support more than 1000 iPhone users, yet you
assume otherwise. Your bias is on display here. You are more willing to
believe a survey of anonymous participants where the methodology is not
in evidence published by this website, yet unwilling to believe a
similar survey done by someone else, why? Because it isn't published on
a website? You do realize anyone can publish anything on a website,
right?
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
And while I realize this is anecdotal, I find it hard to believe
Well done for revealing your internal bias.
On the contrary, unlike the website publishing this survey, I've told
you my results are anecdotal.
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
a significant number of iPhone users even care about such a trivial
thing. This whole thing smacks of anti-intellectual tribalism (aka
zealotry) being pushed by trolls.
The only evidence of "anti-intellectual tribalism" is coming from you.
Says the guy who blindly believes a survey without knowing anything
about the methodologies used... 🤡
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-12 17:21:01 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as a
green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults
in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely nothing
actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result". :-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
You're doing a numerical comparison not a statistical one.
A meaningless distinction since we know nothing at all about the
methodology used in this survey.
It's not meaningless. You're comparing apples and oranges.

Simply one number is bigger than another doesn't intrinsically mean it is
note important.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Population samples which are tiny fractions of the whole can be very
reliable. There is a whole scientific field of statistical sampling.
Again, there's no evidence any scientific method was used here. If there
was, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
That's not the reason we're having this discussion...
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
The article also tells nothing about how these people were selected
or approached for questioning - but you're certain the outcome is
relevant?
I explicitly said I wasn't certain. Note the "if".
Neither am I, which is in fact the entire point.
Yet you're the one getting annoyed by the result.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
You, however, are certain they are not relevant based on literally no
evidence other than dumb maths.
No, in fact my doubts are based on the lack of evidence. And that's how
science actually works.
There is evidence. The results in the survey in fact. The fact you choose
to disregard them is your opinion.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Do you work for a circus, by chance?
I know many people who use iPhones. I don't know any of them who
think less of anyone simply due to what kind of phone they happen to
use.
Lol. You are literally arguing that your tiny n of a highly biased set
is more significant than when n = 1000 in a formal survey. jfc.
I know, work with and support more than 1000 iPhone users, yet you
assume otherwise.
Sure you do. And you know all their opinions on coloured bubbles do you?
Post by Jolly Roger
Your bias is on display here.
I have none. I literally do not care what the survey says. My bone is you
and yourname are desperately trying to dispute the survey simply because
you disagree with the results.
Post by Jolly Roger
You are more willing to
believe a survey of anonymous participants where the methodology is not
in evidence published by this website, yet unwilling to believe a
similar survey done by someone else, why? Because it isn't published on
a website? You do realize anyone can publish anything on a website,
right?
I don't believe the survey more. I'm simply highlighting the weakness in
your position. You could be right, but you've shown nothing but bias and
anecdote. Try harder.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
And while I realize this is anecdotal, I find it hard to believe
Well done for revealing your internal bias.
On the contrary, unlike the website publishing this survey, I've told
you my results are anecdotal.
And yet still using them as a basis to refute the other results which means
you think yours are more important. Simply based on bias.
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
a significant number of iPhone users even care about such a trivial
thing. This whole thing smacks of anti-intellectual tribalism (aka
zealotry) being pushed by trolls.
The only evidence of "anti-intellectual tribalism" is coming from you.
Says the guy who blindly believes a survey without knowing anything
about the methodologies used... 🤡
I don't care what the survey says.
Jolly Roger
2024-10-13 18:52:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as
a green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous
adults in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely
nothing actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result".
:-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
You're doing a numerical comparison not a statistical one.
A meaningless distinction since we know nothing at all about the
methodology used in this survey.
It's not meaningless.
This entire thread is meaningless.
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Chris
2024-10-13 22:13:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as
a green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous
adults in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely
nothing actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result".
:-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
You're doing a numerical comparison not a statistical one.
A meaningless distinction since we know nothing at all about the
methodology used in this survey.
It's not meaningless.
This entire thread is meaningless.
You're simply regretting your decision to join it.
Alan Browne
2024-10-13 22:53:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
You're simply regretting your decision to join it.
Why don't we ll enjoy the opportunity to no longer participate in it?
--
"It would be a measureless disaster if Russian barbarism overlaid
the culture and independence of the ancient States of Europe."
Winston Churchill
Jolly Roger
2024-10-14 16:57:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Jolly Roger
Post by Chris
Post by Your Name
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep
tensions between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be
imagining it. According to a new survey conducted by All About
Cookies, some iPhone users "think less" of others represented as
a green bubble while texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered
switching to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that
it's a better device, but because they've felt pressured or
ridiculed into making the change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous
adults in July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
<snip>
Wow! A whole 1000 ... what's that, 0.000000000000001% of users?
What a cmoplete waste of time and money. There's absolutely
nothing actually meaningful nor useful in that survey "result".
:-\
You've no idea how surveying works. If done correctly 1-2 thousand
ppl is a good sized survey.
Apple sold 2.5 BILLION iPhones (as of 2023, so not counting 2024),
and you are trying to tell us that a survey of 1000 people is
significant? Quick question: How many times do you think 1000 goes
into 2.5 billion?
You're doing a numerical comparison not a statistical one.
A meaningless distinction since we know nothing at all about the
methodology used in this survey.
It's not meaningless.
This entire thread is meaningless.
You're simply regretting your decision to join it.
Nah, I don't regret anything. 🤣
--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR
Alan
2024-10-12 17:29:42 UTC
Permalink
On 2024-10-09 07:30, badgolferman wrote:

'We receive compensation from the products and services mentioned in
this story,'

<https://allaboutcookies.org/apple-vs-android>

'Nuff said.
Post by badgolferman
If you're an Android user, and you've been sensing some deep tensions
between yourself and iPhone users, you may not be imagining it.
According to a new survey conducted by All About Cookies, some iPhone
users "think less" of others represented as a green bubble while
texting, which often depicts Android users.
Conversely, a notable number of Android users have considered switching
to iPhone. Not necessarily because they believe that it's a better
device, but because they've felt pressured or ridiculed into making the
change.
For this study, All About Cookies surveyed 1,000 anonymous adults in
July 2024 via Pollfish, a market research survey tool.
Among the iPhone users surveyed in the study, nearly a quarter — 22
percent — admit that they look down on users that send "non-iMessage
texts" (e.g., Android users). However, 78 percent of iPhone-owning
participants say they don't feel superior to green-bubble senders.
Interestingly, 23 percent of iPhone users get turned off when they
discover that a potential love interest comes up as a green bubble in
their first text conversation, calling it a "dealbreaker."
The survey looked at how male and female participants differed in their
responses. One question asked, "Would it be a dealbreaker for someone
you were interested in to use a non-Apple phone?" Thirty-one percent of
men said yes; 16 percent of women said the same.
The survey discovered that 52 percent of Android users were "made fun
of at some point" by iPhone users for their mobile device; 36 percent
said they were "negatively judged." Twenty-six percent confessed to
feeling embarrassed about their Android device.
Additionally, 30 percent of Android users considered switching due to
peer pressure, the survey revealed.
While there’s some friction between Android and iPhone users, the
survey found that both camps are seek equal footing by exploring more
seamless messaging platforms (e.g., WhatsApp).
Forty-two percent said yes when asked, "Have you ever switched to a
third-party messaging app to accommodate non-iOS users?"
While Apple hasn't shown any indication that it will drop the green
bubbles any time soon, the Cupertino-based tech giant now supports RCS
messaging (also known as Rich Communication Services) in Messages with
the launch of iOS 18.
Without RCS Messaging support, Android and iPhone users experienced
some foibles while messaging each other. For example, videos and
pictures appeared blurry and low-quality due to heavy media
compression. Plus, there are no read receipts nor typing indicators.
However, as mentioned, that is now changing with iOS 18.
Expect higher-quality media sharing and other modern messaging features
between iPhone and Android users, thanks to iOS 18. The only thing that
won't be featured with iPhone-supported RCS is end-to-end encryption,
though the GSM Association (Global System for Mobile Communications),
which is at the helm of the RCS standard, is working to bring
end-to-end encryption to both mobile operating systems.
https://mashable.com/article/iphone-users-think-less-of-android-users-green-bubbles
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