iPhone USB access

[Andrew]

I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone, and I see articles
about apps that let ppl share files with their PCs, and I'm wondering
why is there such an app? If I plug an iPhone into my PC's USB port, do
I not get access to the iPhone's filesysten?

No. All you see are photos and videos from the camera.

https://discussions.apple.com/welcome

So you don't need to go there.

Apple likes their walled garden. The article below mentions iTunes.
The OP didn't mention his PC's OS. iTunes runs on Windows. Maybe runs
under WINE on Linux. By its name, not sure if it only allows access to
media folders, or to all folders. Never bothered with anything Apple.
https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/transfer-files-between-devices-iphf2d851b9/ios

Well, iOS is clearly off-topic as VanguardLH's first answer hints.
So I'll just say, as someone who uses an Android tablet, an
iPhone, Linux and Windows PCs (though not a Mac) that the iOS is
the most difficult to get stuff into and out off and and between
apps - by design - especially if you don't want to use a cloud
service such as Dropbox. I often use FTP.

Total nonsense. No reasonable person would do this. You can try but it
is only for people with a lot of spare time.

You're right: normal iPhone users would not do it. I mentioned it
because it's the nearest equivalent to transferring (non-camera)
files from an Android to a PC via USB. And I only do it to get
certain files onto or off my iPhone without using a cloud service
- iCloud, Dropbox, etc. Using a cloud service is the easy way to
do it.
Several iOS apps have FTP functions built it, such as my media
player, foobar2000.

So, you can not simply connect an USB cable to phone and computer and
the explorer pops up and handle the copy of any file in any direction?
How weird.

For the Android team to know (based on years of experience with iOS)...

As you're all well aware, I own plenty of Windows, iOS & Android devices.
And I don't use the cloud for anything - so I use USB & Wi-Fi file xfers.

I concur with all that said prior to this point in this thread (except
anything the moron Joerg Lorenz or Alan Baker ever says, both of whom are
in my killfile which has fewer than a dozen people in it for decades on
Usenet - they're that worthless) that Apple makes bidirectional file
transfer inordinately difficult - particularly for putting media onto the
Apple device - which can't be done directly.

Worse - if you add the iTunes abomination to Windows, you're subject to
multiple zero-day holes as Apple's support has been historically terrible.

However, if you dual boot your PC to Ubuntu, if you know a few very
delicate tricks not widely known, you can get limited bidirectional USB
file transfer due to the Linux iFuse implementation Windows lacks.

Why Windows lacks iFuse is a mystery to me only those more knowledgeable
than I am can answer for the team, as iFuse is what Windows needs for this.

<Loading Image...> iOS/Win is 1-way & DCIM only
<Loading Image...> iOS "Files" is nothing useful
<Loading Image...> Android is two way, everything
<Loading Image...> Ubuntu is two way, everything
<Loading Image...> Ubuntu, movies _to_ iOS on USB
<Loading Image...> Ubuntu iFuse is just magical
<Loading Image...> Ubuntu is two-way, everything
<Loading Image...> iOS is a dumb brick on Windows
<Loading Image...> iOS is only DCIM & only 1-way
<Loading Image...> Android is 2-way fast over USB
<Loading Image...> iOS requires hacks to copy
<Loading Image...> iOS hacks very often will fail
<Loading Image...> How does macOS work with iOS?
<Loading Image...> Linux, win10 & iOS together
<Loading Image...> ditch itunes abomination

[Andrew]

I've been backing up iPads to Windows PCs for years, using iTunes.
The program is heavy and cluttered, but it does work and it gives me
access to all the books, pictures, videos etc. on the Pad.
I tried out a few other apps, such as iBrowse, but they promised more
than they delivered. And then I found out that they simply browsed the
Windows files created by iTunes. Sneaky devils!

Ed Cryer is correct, however the installation of Windows iTunes
historically has been considered the canonical example of bloatware.
<https://www.zdnet.com/article/the-unofficial-guide-to-installing-itunes-10-without-bloatware/>

Of course, with effort, you can remove most of the Apple bloatware.
<https://www.howtogeek.com/28727/how-to-install-itunes-without-extra-bloat/>

The Windows iTunes is poorly supported by Apple so it's also generally
considered an example of unnecessary tools which add zero-day holes.
<https://cybersecuritynews.com/itunes-0-day-privilege-escalation-windows/>

The existence of so many 0-day holes shows Apple has never tested iTunes.
<https://duckduckgo.com/?t=h_&q=window+itunes+security+zero-day>

Worse, when you add iTunes, you actually *reduce* Windows' functionality!
<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>
<Loading Image...>

Still, I have as many iOS devices (along with Windows & Android) as anyone
does, so you just have to live with the fact Apple hates interoperability.

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Andrew
Of course, with effort, you can remove most of the Apple bloatware.
<https://www.howtogeek.com/28727/how-to-install-itunes-without-extra-
bloat/>

Good Lord, pal; that article is from 2010, moving from Itunes 9 to 10.
I'm on 12 +++

Ed

[Alan]

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by Andrew
Of course, with effort, you can remove most of the Apple bloatware.
<https://www.howtogeek.com/28727/how-to-install-itunes-without-extra-
bloat/>

Good Lord, pal; that article is from 2010, moving from Itunes 9 to 10.
I'm on 12 +++

Arlen (Andrew) isn't much interested in facts.

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Alan

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by Andrew
Of course, with effort, you can remove most of the Apple bloatware.
<https://www.howtogeek.com/28727/how-to-install-itunes-without-extra-
bloat/>

Good Lord, pal; that article is from 2010, moving from Itunes 9 to 10.
I'm on 12 +++

Arlen (Andrew) isn't much interested in facts.

Arlen, Arlen, Arlen.
WhoTF is this ghost who wanders the corridors of these newsgroups like
Hamlet's father around the walls of Elsinore castle?
It used to be trolls; anyone either rather aggressive or possessed of an
intellect that could enquire beyond the superficial ordinariness of
life. But now it's Arlen.

Ed

[Andrew]

Post by Ed Cryer
Good Lord, pal; that article is from 2010, moving from Itunes 9 to 10.
I'm on 12 +++

Your argument against iTunes bloatware that it's "old" bloatware is absurd.
Apple hasn't updated iTunes in years - yet you're still using it today.

If you're using iTunes on Windows (which even Apple has deprecated on Apple
devices), it's still bloatware whether or not it's "old" or new bloatware.

Historically, the canonical example of unneccessary bloat was 'iTunes'.
It literally subtracts functionality (see the images proving that fact).

*The end of the world's infamous bloatware (iTunes) is nigh!*
<https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/the-end-of-the-worlds-infamous-bloatware-(itunes)-is-nigh!/>

[Alan]

Post by Andrew

Post by Ed Cryer
Good Lord, pal; that article is from 2010, moving from Itunes 9 to 10.
I'm on 12 +++

Your argument against iTunes bloatware that it's "old" bloatware is absurd.
Apple hasn't updated iTunes in years - yet you're still using it today.

Wow. You can't even read.

Apple's latest update to iTunes for Windows was released on exactly two
months ago today:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_iTunes#iTunes_12>

"12.13.4.4"

Post by Andrew
If you're using iTunes on Windows (which even Apple has deprecated on Apple
devices), it's still bloatware whether or not it's "old" or new bloatware.
Historically, the canonical example of unneccessary bloat was 'iTunes'.
It literally subtracts functionality (see the images proving that fact).

What "images"?

And "even Apple has deprecated"? Who OTHER than Apple could deprecate
Apple software?

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Alan
Apple's latest update to iTunes for Windows was released on exactly two
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_iTunes#iTunes_12>
"12.13.4.4"

Quite so. And notice how large it is; 38MB.

Ed

[Paul]

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by Alan
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_iTunes#iTunes_12>
"12.13.4.4"

Quite so. And notice how large it is; 38MB.
Ed

I think the earlier iTunes had Quicktime for video
playback of music videos or something.

Apple no longer wanted to invest as much in
security updates for the "fleet" inside
the installer... so they simplified the design
and the feature set a bit. That's why a package
today can be smaller than some previous ones.
And it might not be playing movies.

Back in the day, the .msi files inside the installer,
were a bit independent of one another. You may have
had the option, of picking apart the installer and
only installing some of the .msi. But Apple put
a stop to that, by "cross-coupling" or purposely
making dependencies between the installations,
to ensure they all got installed.

One of the packages was Bonjour. Bonjour is open
sourced, so anyone can look at the source code.
There are a number of name server softwares,
and likely, some duplication of effort. If you
run iTunes, you may end up with one of those
running as a service on a machine.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonjour_%28software%29

mDNSResponder

This is the kind of software, where you can use 7ZIP
to inspect inside the thing, for the "components".
And there is an MSI unpacker available, if you want
to do further detective work, such as discover
the name of the DVD burner software inside iTunes :-)
That's a third party plugin.

It's like going to the zoo and discovering
they have animals in there.

Paul

[Andrew]

Post by Paul
It's like going to the zoo and discovering
they have animals in there

Given Apple has not only the absolute worst bugfix support in the industry
(which is why iOS is the most exploited mobile phone in history!)...
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>

Unfortunately, the Apple iTunes bloatware abomination on Windows is even
worse than anyone can imagine...

Not so much for its unnecessary forced bloat (such as those Paul already
noted) nor for Apple's incessant huge rampant security holes...

But also because when you install Apple iTunes on Windows, you actually
*lose* functionality!

For example:
1. This is the version of SharePod that I used on Windows 10:
<Loading Image...>
2. The SharePod interface gives you unrestricted access to MP3 files:
<Loading Image...>
3. Here we batch copy (& rename) files from iPod to Windows 10:
<Loading Image...>
4. Resulting in an organized archive of all files on any number of iPods:
<Loading Image...>
5. Populate the iPod by syncing with any number of Windows MP3 files:
<Loading Image...>
6. If desired, the ID3 tags can all be batch organized to your liking:
<Loading Image...>
7. With the result that you have unrestricted access to your iPod:
<Loading Image...>

However... the very instant you install Apple's iTunes abomination...

*EVERYTHING above STOPS WORKING!* (iTunes removes the functionality!)

Just like Apple removed the aux jack so that you'd have to scramble to
figure out a way to purchase it back - iTunes *removes functionality* too!

<https://i.postimg.cc/fRtZFGSt/sharepod01.jpg> itunes removes functionality

[Alan]

Post by Andrew

Post by Paul
It's like going to the zoo and discovering
they have animals in there

Given Apple has not only the absolute worst bugfix support in the industry
(which is why iOS is the most exploited mobile phone in history!)...
<https://www.cisa.gov/known-exploited-vulnerabilities-catalog>
Unfortunately, the Apple iTunes bloatware abomination on Windows is even
worse than anyone can imagine...
Not so much for its unnecessary forced bloat (such as those Paul already
noted) nor for Apple's incessant huge rampant security holes...
But also because when you install Apple iTunes on Windows, you actually
*lose* functionality!
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod001.jpg>
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod002.jpg>
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod003.jpg>
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod004.jpg>
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod005.jpg>
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod006.jpg>
  <http://img4.imagetitan.com/img.php?image=18_ipod007.jpg>
However... the very instant you install Apple's iTunes abomination...
*EVERYTHING above STOPS WORKING!* (iTunes removes the functionality!)

Funny the folks at Sharepod disagree:

'If you have a regular iPod such as a Classic, Nano, or Shuffle, it's
recommended to check the box to "Enable Disk Use" in iTunes on the
Summary tab for it and click on Apply. That setting will help your iPod
stay connected in Sharepod and iTunes.

​Sharepod uses the iTunes interface to connect with an iPhone, iPad, or
iPod, so if your device is appearing in iTunes without any errors, it
should also appear in Sharepod. '

Post by Andrew
Just like Apple removed the aux jack so that you'd have to scramble to
figure out a way to purchase it back - iTunes *removes functionality* too!
<https://i.postimg.cc/fRtZFGSt/sharepod01.jpg> itunes removes functionality

Seems like maybe user incompetence...

[Andrew]

I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone, and I see articles
about apps that let ppl share files with their PCs, and I'm wondering
why is there such an app? If I plug an iPhone into my PC's USB port, do
I not get access to the iPhone's filesysten?

iPhones don't have a filesystem.
Well, of course they do, but they really don't want you to see it.
The way iOS works is it's very app-centric. Apps own their own buckets of
data which only they can see. The way to move things between apps is the
'Share' function, rather than app B opening a file saved by app A.
Of course files do exist outside the iOS world, so places like Photos,
Videos, Music and Downloads have some kind of specialness in that apps can
ask to open files from there (not generically - a photo app can't see
Music). But apps can't open files from other random places, and especially
not files in the buckets belonging to other apps.

Has anyone here ever *seen* the iOS DCIM file system organization?
*If not, you're in for a big surprise!*

Files all over the place, in almost randomly named folders (such as
_201901) with randomly named image file names (such as IMG1234.JPG).
<Loading Image...>

No other operating system refuses to allow you to name your image files.
Just Apple.

Meanwhile, every other operating system (except Apple's) allows the user to
define how they want photo images to be named (using a sensible convention)
<Loading Image...>

Some day Apple will care about the consumer.
But that day hasn't arrived yet.

[Alan]

Post by Andrew

I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone, and I see articles
about apps that let ppl share files with their PCs, and I'm wondering
why is there such an app? If I plug an iPhone into my PC's USB port,
do I not get access to the iPhone's filesysten?

iPhones don't have a filesystem.
Well, of course they do, but they really don't want you to see it.
The way iOS works is it's very app-centric.  Apps own their own
buckets of
data which only they can see.  The way to move things between apps is the
'Share' function, rather than app B opening a file saved by app A.
Of course files do exist outside the iOS world, so places like Photos,
Videos, Music and Downloads have some kind of specialness in that apps can
ask to open files from there (not generically - a photo app can't see
Music).  But apps can't open files from other random places, and
especially
not files in the buckets belonging to other apps.

Has anyone here ever *seen* the iOS DCIM file system organization?
         *If not, you're in for a big surprise!*
Files all over the place, in almost randomly named folders (such as
_201901) with randomly named image file names (such as IMG1234.JPG).
<https://i.postimg.cc/PJ4hWyS0/Apple-Iphone.jpg>

How are those "randomly named".

It appears that they're named in the absolutely ordinary way of
sequentially numbered.

Post by Andrew
No other operating system refuses to allow you to name your image files.
Just Apple.
Meanwhile, every other operating system (except Apple's) allows the user to
define how they want photo images to be named (using a sensible convention)
<https://i.postimg.cc/zfgrt8dC/Samsung.jpg>

That doesn't show any proof that it's user configurable. It appears it's
simply a YYYYMMDD_HHMMSS naming convention.

And that seems pretty redundant as files already have
creation/modification date/time metadata associated with them.

:-)

Post by Andrew
Some day Apple will care about the consumer. But that day hasn't arrived
yet.

LOL!

[Andrew]

Good day.
I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone, and I see articles
about apps that let ppl share files with their PCs, and I'm wondering
why is there such an app? If I plug an iPhone into my PC's USB port, do
I not get access to the iPhone's filesysten?

Others have already answered your specific questions.
As to "I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone": As you're a
Windows user ('PC' != Windows), I would advise against buying/using an
iPhone.
The Android-Windows integration is not great, but there is - as you
have found - some. For iPhone-Windows, there's hardly anything, except
for the iTunes abomination.
Granted, the Windows 'Phone Link' app apparently supports Android
smartphones and iPhones. But with the iPhones being 'closed' and the
Android smartphones being (more) 'open', I think with an iPhone you'll
be in for a disappointment.
OTOH, if you intend to use the iPhone mostly by itself and hardly need
to exchange anything (other than photos from its camera) with your
Windows system, by all means go for it.
FWIW, I've been confronted with the iPhone-Windows limitations. OTOH,
some of my loved ones are an all-Apple houshold and they are very, very
pleased with it, including the *HP* :-) printer.

Given Apple's strategy is to hinder interoperability with other systems...

I must echo Frank's sentiment that the only people who are on Windows
already switching from Android to iOS, are those who are going to be sorry.

There are reasons why Apple's products are created as dumb terminals.
Apple's ecosystem is designed to make things only work in their ecosystem.

As a result, nothing in Apple's ecosystem actually works in the real world.

[Alan]

Post by Andrew

Good day.
I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone, and I see articles
about apps that let ppl share files with their PCs, and I'm wondering
why is there such an app? If I plug an iPhone into my PC's USB port,
do I not get access to the iPhone's filesysten?

  Others have already answered your specific questions.
  As to "I'm an Android user thinking of getting an iPhone": As you're a
Windows user ('PC' != Windows), I would advise against buying/using an
iPhone.
  The Android-Windows integration is not great, but there is - as you
have found - some. For iPhone-Windows, there's hardly anything, except
for the iTunes abomination.
  Granted, the Windows 'Phone Link' app apparently supports Android
smartphones and iPhones. But with the iPhones being 'closed' and the
Android smartphones being (more) 'open', I think with an iPhone you'll
be in for a disappointment.
  OTOH, if you intend to use the iPhone mostly by itself and hardly need
to exchange anything (other than photos from its camera) with your
Windows system, by all means go for it.
  FWIW, I've been confronted with the iPhone-Windows limitations. OTOH,
some of my loved ones are an all-Apple houshold and they are very, very
pleased with it, including the *HP* :-) printer.

Given Apple's strategy is to hinder interoperability with other systems...
I must echo Frank's sentiment that the only people who are on Windows
already switching from Android to iOS, are those who are going to be sorry.
There are reasons why Apple's products are created as dumb terminals.
Apple's ecosystem is designed to make things only work in their ecosystem.
As a result, nothing in Apple's ecosystem actually works in the real world.

Amazing.

Every thing you said... ...is wrong.